Home Forums Ganymede & Titan Forum Russell Two Davies

Viewing 49 posts - 151 through 199 (of 199 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #291583
    Dave
    Participant

    I thought the first 20 minutes or so were a bit stilted but once Ruby got out on the rooftops and the goblins showed up in full it became a fun romp. I also liked the teases for future stories and the trailer for next season looks fun.

    #291584

    Yeah that was greta fun. Love both Ncuti and Millie.  Loads of energy.  The sense of magic and wonder is back.  Teases for the future.  Fun romp with deep connection to the characters back story.  It’s like like a clashing of RTD and Moffat era who which is great.  Brilliant return to form.

    #291588
    Warbodog
    Participant

    Haven’t managed to finish it yet, but it nailed the 80s fantasy vibe and took me back to watching Labyrinth and things, so kids should love it. That’s probably enough to put it in the top half of the Christmas specials* for me, not that I remember some of them too well.

    I take it the “no family” Doctor either fell out with the Nobles or eventually watched them all die.

    * Top 5: 2010, 2014, 2015, 2013, 2012

    #291590
    Dave
    Participant

    Yeah, Christmas Carol is the best xmas special for me, just lovely.

    #291594
    Warbodog
    Participant

    Mysterious neighbour (Anita Dobson) was Captain Tau in Psirens, but of course, we all know that.

    #291596

    Rumour has it they booked Anita Dobson for Doctor Who because they wanted Brian May to play the guitar in the goblin band, but he declined.

    #291599
    Jonathan Capps
    Keymaster

    Anita Dobson

    Well you should’ve gone before we set off

    #291600
    Renegade Rob
    Participant

    Enjoyed special, but due to timey-wimeyness had to rewatch to fully wrap my head around when the Doctor first organically “met” Ruby and at what point he latched onto her Columbo-style during his investigation. Unless I’m wrong, he legit happened to just be partying in that club when they met and he wasn’t at that point fully intrigued by her deal yet (he caught that gin and tonic so fast I thought they were gonna reveal his future self went back Matt Smith-style and caught it like he did with the Davina tree) I guess the snowman clinched it for him, which is why he was on that roof later. But I originally thought he was hanging around her even at the club because he’d already pre-episode decided to follow her. Whatever, it’s Davies so I have to relearn how to not overthink things. It’s the electrocuting-the-security-guards-in-the-door-frame all over again.

    Impaling the goblin king was cold as ice though, like jeez you almost stabbed a baby, and come on man, they’re just trying to eat, like cut them a break.

    Also, I get that the ship was working on fairy tale logic, but an evil alien ship over London seems slightly less feasible now what with that Tony Stark UNIT tower with the galvanic laser right there.

    #291605

    #291606

    I think he was partying at the club, but he also did go back to catch the glass. That’s how he moved across the room so quickly. It was a different version of him. 
    That’s why he gives her that little “it’s worse than that” bit when she says she’s accident prone. 

    #291609

    #293361
    Jenuall
    Participant

    Sounds like Moffat is back with an episode for the new series as well! Quite pleased with that 

    #293362

    Me too. He’s back to his roots and doing what he was doing when he wrote his best episodes, without the pressure of running the series.

    #293363
    Dave
    Participant

    Definitely. Maybe even worth staying up until midnight for.

    #293365
    Flap Jack
    Participant

    I can’t believe it took the BBC over 7 years to beat the genius of Red Dwarf XI’s digital release schedule.

    #293374
    Ian Symes
    Keymaster

    Me too. He’s back to his roots and doing what he was doing when he wrote his best episodes, without the pressure of running the series.

    His best episodes like Heaven Sent, The Day of the Doctor, World Enough and Time/The Doctor Falls and The Eleventh Hour?

    #293376
    Unrumble
    Participant

    Me too. He’s back to his roots and doing what he was doing when he wrote his best episodes, without the pressure of running the series.

    His best episodes like Heaven Sent, The Day of the Doctor, World Enough and Time/The Doctor Falls and The Eleventh Hour?

    #293378
    Dave
    Participant

    Moffat did some great episodes both during the RTD1 era and his own tenure as showrunner, but I think what most of his greatest hits all have in common is that they’re fairly accessible stories based around great central concepts that stand alone without too much involvement with/obligation to the overall season arc.

    Whereas his less good stories tend to be the ones where he’s more bogged down with those wider ideas and has less of a singular focus on the story at hand. (Somehow though, Day of the Doctor does both, spectacularly well, and gets better with every rewatch.)

    So having him come in to do one-off stories is a treat and very exciting.

    #293379
    Warbodog
    Participant

    Series 5 to early 6 is the peak of the series for me, before it admittedly went off the rails but was still watchable. His early hits all have similar themes when you break them down, so maybe we’ll get some new twisted variation on a playground game.

    #293381
    Ian Symes
    Keymaster

    Whereas I think the Moffat era really picked up after that slump around Series 7, with Series 9 being my absolute favourite of the revived series. Series 10 felt really fresh and Bill could have been an all time great companion had she been around for longer. I feel Moffat was really back on the rise when he left.

    Either way, I am of course excited that he’s back doing one-off(s). It can’t be denied that his hit rate was unmatched during RTD1, four for four absolute bangers. Naturally the average will go down when you’re writing (at least) that many each year rather than one a year, but the heights during his era were just as high as they were when he was a guest writer.

    #293383
    Dave
    Participant

    Heaven Sent is probably his masterpiece, so yes I agree with that.

    In general I think he’s pretty clearly the most consistently good writer for the show since the reboot, so his return in any capacity is a great thing. Seeing Gatwa in a Moffat story is going to be a treat.

    #293384
    Ben Saunders
    Participant

    Moffat is back! And you know what that means! Moffat Discourse is back! (It never went anywhere).

    Seriously though, Twitter is almost unuseable these days for several reasons, one of them being my For You section being inundated with Chibnall stans attacking anything and everything about the new era for whatever reason they can find, RTD stans screaming at them like it’ll help, and a worrying amount of people somehow still hashing out the same old talking points from 2014.

    I am of course extremely excited for Moffat coming back, since his batting average is extremely high. But even Robert Holmes has the odd Power of Kroll.

    Series 5 to early 6 is the peak of the series for me, before it admittedly went off the rails but was still watchable.

    Sounds familiar.

    #293385
    Dave
    Participant

    His early hits all have similar themes when you break them down, so maybe we’ll get some new twisted variation on a playground game.

    #293387
    Flap Jack
    Participant

    My dominant feeling in reaction to this Moffat news is disappointment. Not because I expect his episode to be bad, but because Steven Moffat has written more Doctor Who TV stories than anyone else in history already, by a significant margin. We know more than well enough what Moffat Who is like, and this era is already going to be predominantly written by an old hand (on top of the returning producers and composer) – would it have killed them to get another new writer in the mix???

    Out of the whole upcoming series, a maximum of 2 episodes are credited to someone other than a former showrunner. That’s pathetic.

    Right now, not only am I more excited by the episode written by Kate Herron and Briony Redman, I’m also more excited by the episode written by ‘TBA’.

    #293388
    Jenuall
    Participant

    There is a definite wobble in the Moffat era as we transition toward the end of Matt Smith and then start getting up and running with Capaldi, but overall I find his tenure to be the strongest and most enjoyable from “New Who” so far.

    Series 5 is peak for me, I could rewatch that run endlessly. Maybe there is something about British sci-fi and the 5th series of things as V is peak Dwarf as well. Also both series end with references to someone jump starting a big bang with their space craft…

    #293389
    Dave
    Participant

    DW Series 5 and RD Series V also both feature:

    – one of our heroes sacrificing his own happiness to save the woman he loves, knowing they can’t be together

    – a mysterious cosmic force wiping people from existence altogether

    – a world being remade based on the contents of someone’s mind

    – three people being trapped in their ship by a psychotic version of one of the crew

    – evil versions of our heroes, and Angels

    – confusion between a fake reality and the real world

    #293390
    Jenuall
    Participant

    #293391
    Flap Jack
    Participant

    What people really mean when they say Steven Moffat’s episodes were the best

    #293426
    si
    Participant

    For some reason, I’ve not been as excited about the upcoming season as I really want to be. Maybe it’s just because I didn’t really think the Christmas special was anywhere near the highs of the 60th Specials, but I’m not even reading DWM the same as I normally do – the last couple of months, its been a few pages, then the rest has had a cursory glance and left largely unread.

    Didn’t mind about the simultaneous premiere as it was announced, but then the realisation that everyone else was going to be able to watch at a comfortable afternoon/evening time hit me, and that we were going to lose the immediacy of everyone Tweeting about the same thing at the same (reasonable) time that the live TV premieres I rushed home from work for back in October always brought.

    So given all that, I’ve got ti say that, for me, the return of Moffat us actually the most exciting news Who-wise for quite a little while, something I’m properly looking forward to. And another great writer that poor Jodie missed out on.

    #293983
    RainbowGazelle
    Participant

    Twice Upon A Time is an absolute emotional banger, and I refuse to hear otherwise.

    For some reason, I’ve not been as excited about the upcoming season as I really want to be. Maybe it’s just because I didn’t really think the Christmas special was anywhere near the highs of the 60th Specials, but I’m not even reading DWM the same as I normally do – the last couple of months, its been a few pages, then the rest has had a cursory glance and left largely unread.
    Didn’t mind about the simultaneous premiere as it was announced, but then the realisation that everyone else was going to be able to watch at a comfortable afternoon/evening time hit me, and that we were going to lose the immediacy of everyone Tweeting about the same thing at the same (reasonable) time that the live TV premieres I rushed home from work for back in October always brought.
    So given all that, I’ve got ti say that, for me, the return of Moffat us actually the most exciting news Who-wise for quite a little while, something I’m properly looking forward to. And another great writer that poor Jodie missed out on.

    I’m feeling the same for a few reasons. I’m concerned with RTD rebooting certain aspects of the show. It’s difficult to feel excited when they’re intentionally changing histories of characters. Like what’s the point of watching if you’ll just reboot it in the future? It’s not the same show anymore. I also thought the Christmas special was quite “meh”, but I’m trying to keep an open mind. Maybe it’s the advertising for the new series? It feels off, but difficult to exlpain why. It’s very overly bombastic and faux positive. Too movie-like? Sorta fake, “we’re going on an adventure!!!!!!!” Hollywood advertising. I’m hoping the actual series is more down to earth with the acting.


    EDIT: I am excited about Moffat returning, however. He’s Doctor Who’s best writer by far.

    #293989
    Flap Jack
    Participant

    I’m feeling the same for a few reasons. I’m concerned with RTD rebooting certain aspects of the show. It’s difficult to feel excited when they’re intentionally changing histories of characters.

    Wait, what aspects is he rebooting, other than the series numbering? (Not to say that isn’t stupid. “Season 1” is some blatant Doug Naylor-esque fuckery.)

    #293991
    Dave
    Participant

    It reminds me of the relatively recent trend in comics to reboot some of the big long-running titles with new #1 issues when new creative teams come on board.

    I get the impulse from a commercial point of view – you’re signaling that this is a fresh start, and a new-audience-friendly jumping-on point – but at the same time you lose a sense of continuity and history and legacy, not to mention making it increasingly confusing in discussions to describe which of the various “firsts” you’re talking about.

    #293992
    Ian Symes
    Keymaster

    Moffat also tried to call his first series Series 1, and that disappeared within months. And considering that the four episodes of RTD2 so far have involved bringing back a companion from the 80s, addressing the aftermath of recent events like Flux and the Timeless Children, and having a one-off First Doctor adversary as the main big bad, I’m not concerned about the past being rebooted. If you want to talk about changing characters’ histories, RTD is the only modern series showrunner who hasn’t added hitherto unknown past incarnations of the Doctor.

    #293993
    Flap Jack
    Participant

    It does seem like the series number reset – and in general the division of the revived series into “Doctor Who (2005-2022)” and “Doctor Who (2023-)” – is happening entirely for the benefit of Disney, and their probable worry that potential new viewers will be scared away if they see that the earliest series available on Disney+ is “Series 14”.

    Strong evidence for this is that the first episode of Doctor Who ’23 isn’t The Church on Ruby Road, but The Star Beast. If it was meant to be a soft reboot narratively, starting with such a direct sequel to the David Tennant era – that leads into a sequel to a William Hartnell story, featuring characters originally from the Colin Baker and Matt Smith eras – would be utterly insane.

    I get that you can also argue that there’s never been a Doctor/top producer changeover that entailed a gap between episodes of over a year in the revived series before, and therefore starting again at series 1 is warranted, but it feels like a very arbitrary line to draw. The gap was nothing compared to the 16 year hiatus that brought about the last Series 1 (whether or not you count the TV movie), and it wasn’t even as long as the mid 80s hiatus.

    It’s especially weird, because usually TV series only reset their season numbers if it’s an actual hard reboot with no shared continuity (e.g. Charmed), or if the show itself gets a slightly different title (e.g. Daredevil: Born Again). Doctor Who was already a major exception to that once, but at least up until now we’ve been able to make things clear with the Season/Series distinction. Not any longer. How dare RTD make every fan discussion of either the Gatwa or Hartnell eras of Doctor Who slightly more annoying for the sake of international broadcasters, honestly.

    So, in conclusion, Back to Earth is absolutely Series IX.

    #293996
    Dave
    Participant

    I do wonder whether there might be contractual reasons to establish this incarnation of the show as a brand new series too. Sometimes with these things there are certain obligations to previous creative contributors that apply if the show is a direct continuation but not if it is a new distinct entity, even if only nominally.

    #293997

    featuring characters originally from the Colin Baker and Matt Smith eras

    Bonnie was only in like two full stories with Colin, and one of those was a two-parter. I’d really consider her more a Sylvester McCoy era companion.

    If you want to talk about changing characters’ histories, RTD is the only modern series showrunner who hasn’t added hitherto unknown past incarnations of the Doctor.

    This is true. His original vision of the Time War had Paul McGann be the one to end the war, and he wrote a short story to that effect that’s only recently been released because it was meant to go out in 2013 and that was obviously cancelled when he found out about the War Doctor.

    Also, his depiction of the Time War was way more interesting than Moff’s because it actually had time as an element of the war. You know, because it’s a war in time and not just Daleks shooting at a planet.

    #293999
    Dave
    Participant

    His original vision of the Time War had Paul McGann be the one to end the war,

    That sounds even wilder than the Coronation Street scenes in Back To Earth.

    #294002
    PreeCome
    Participant

    The online and broadcast release is a useful tool to hide the fact the days of better ratings are long gone. Disney won’t hold on to this for long given they themselves are in serious dire straits. This won’t get past two series…sorry seasons.

    I suppose as RTD brought DW back it’s only his right to take it away again. 2005-2025.

    Time….for some movies. Get more worldwide interest from the likes of China and then TV reboot.

    #294004
    Dave
    Participant

    I thought the combined ratings for the latest specials were pretty good?

    I don’t see the show dying any time soon, there seems to be a reasonable commitment to it from both RTD and Disney, although I wouldn’t be surprised if Gatwa only did two or three seasons before moving on, that’s fairly standard. 

    As for a reboot, that suggestion always makes me laugh because the show has a built-in reboot mechanic that means it’s constantly reinventing itself. I don’t think a formal reboot makes much difference given that the show can already change itself entirely while keeping within the continuity of the existing series.

    #294006
    RainbowGazelle
    Participant

    I’m feeling the same for a few reasons. I’m concerned with RTD rebooting certain aspects of the show. It’s difficult to feel excited when they’re intentionally changing histories of characters.
    Wait, what aspects is he rebooting, other than the series numbering? (Not to say that isn’t stupid. “Season 1” is some blatant Doug Naylor-esque fuckery.)

    Stuff like Davros no longer being in his travel machine for example. Although so far that was just in the Comic Relief sketch. If it stays that way, then I don’t mind. And I’m really split (lol) on the bi-generation thing. On one hand it’s cool that Tennant’s Doctor gets to stick around, on the other, it kinda feels like Ncuti isn’t the Doctor, but a clone. A little, anyway. And I personally would have preferred RTD to just ignore some of the 13th Doctor’s era’s rubbish, instead of making it canon. But like I said, I’m trying to keep an open mind. I originally hated the Smith and Capaldi eras because of change (I was a stupid kid), but I absolutely adore them now.

    #294008
    Flap Jack
    Participant

    Bonnie was only in like two full stories with Colin, and one of those was a two-parter. I’d really consider her more a Sylvester McCoy era companion.

    Right, but I just didn’t want to make it a subjective judgement, and added “originally from” to make it clear what I meant. Ironically I was originally going to say “Sylvester McCoy era” but I was worried someone would correct me.

    The online and broadcast release is a useful tool to hide the fact the days of better ratings are long gone.

    If you mean the days of Doctor Who regularly getting 8-10 million viewers in the overnights, then yes they’re over, but that’s a medium wide shift. Doctor Who did very well in the ratings for the 4 RTD2 episodes so far. They’re certainly giving Disney priority for the timings, but it’s not to hide bad ratings.

    In fact, I’m calling it now: the consolidated figures for “Season 1” on the BBC will be higher than the streaming numbers on Disney Plus.

    Disney won’t hold on to this for long given they themselves are in serious dire straits. This won’t get past two series…sorry seasons.

    Nah. Disney Plus is fragile – because of course it is, it’s a streaming service – but the Disney company as a whole is too huge and diverse to be at that kind of risk. Any TV series punches they can just no-sell using their theme park and merchandise profits.

    Also Disney may be putting a lot of money in, but they’re still just an international broadcaster. Even if Doctor Who disastrously fails on Disney Plus and they stop licensing it, the show’s future depends on the BBC not Disney.

    #294010
    Dave
    Participant

    Even if Doctor Who disastrously fails on Disney Plus and they stop licensing it, the show’s future depends on the BBC not Disney.

    Interestingly RTD has suggested recently that part of the thinking behind the Disney+ move is to help protect the show’s prospects in a BBC-less future: https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2024/mar/27/russell-t-davies-says-end-of-bbc-is-undoubtedly-on-its-way

    #294012
    Ian Symes
    Keymaster

    There’s at least one person in this thread who’s desperate to use the word “woke” as a pejorative, you can just tell.

    #294013
    Dave
    Participant

    There’s at least one person in this thread who’s desperate to use the word “woke” as a pejorative, you can just tell.

    #294014
    PreeCome
    Participant

    The ratings were better because of the bait and switch of bringing back David Tennant and then the good will of staying on for a new doctor. Christmas shows tend to rate better also.

    Disney yes is huge and thus the only way is down. Thanks to covid damaging theme park revenues, changing peoples viewing habits and well just folks sick of the watering down of franchises. I’m looking at you Marvel/Star Wars!

    Just saying in the past Disney like Netflix have been ruthless at dropping shows even with bit solid fan bases and not too shabby viewing. I just can’t see DW taking off as much as it is popular in the UK that’s all.

    #294015
    Flap Jack
    Participant

    Well those are some awfully convenient lines of reasoning!

    You say the days of better ratings are GONE, yet those days can apparently be easily recaptured with nostalgic casting, generally offering new stuff, and promoting it well? Something which of course they would never do for the main series. No no, the secret sauce for good ratings can only apply to those 4 episodes, and if the Serieson 14-1 episodes also start getting good ratings (even if not as good as the specials), I’m sure you’ll be ready and waiting to explain why those episodes actually have other unique features to draw in crowds that can’t be repeated, and how the episodes after will be the ones to tank for sure.

    And Disney is huge so the only way is down… ? Come on. You can’t pretend you’re making an actual assessment here if a company’s failure and success are both signs of its imminent collapse. This is what’s known as “confirmation bias”.


    Just saying in the past Disney like Netflix have been ruthless at dropping shows even with bit solid fan bases and not too shabby viewing. I just can’t see DW taking off as much as it is popular in the UK that’s all.

    OK, but my point is that the stakes aren’t that high, because if Disney drop Doctor Who, the BBC will likely still make more of it, it’ll just be on different networks in other countries. I know that streaming services do have a habit of pouring tons of money into something and then cancelling it after a couple of seasons, but the risk there is for shows they actually MAKE.

    It’s also just silly to treat Doctor Who as a huge gamble for Disney, and not something with decades of proven, consistent popularity all over the world.

    #294017

    Right, but I just didn’t want to make it a subjective judgement, and added “originally from” to make it clear what I meant. Ironically I was originally going to say “Sylvester McCoy era” but I was worried someone would correct me.

    So why not just say both? Colin Baker/Sylvester McCoy eras

    #294020
    PreeCome
    Participant

      So why not just say both? Colin Baker/Sylvester McCoy eras

    Sylvester McCoy was my first.

    #294021
    Flap Jack
    Participant

    So why not just say both? Colin Baker/Sylvester McCoy eras

    Because it fit with the rhythm of the rest of the sentence to just say the one name, like with Tennant, Hartnell and Smith. It’s true I could have said “and characters from the Colin Baker/Sylvester McCoy and Matt Smith/Peter Capaldi/Jodie Whittaker eras”, but (A) that’s overly wordy, and (B) by casting the net wide it might have sounded like I was trying to imply more characters returning than just the 2.

    Also like I said, I really thought “originally from” had me covered. 😅

    Of course, the 60th anniversary specials didn’t have the biggest throwbacks in terms of returning classic cast members. The Power of The Doctor featured the return of Tom Baker era companion Tegan Jovanka.

Viewing 49 posts - 151 through 199 (of 199 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.