The “Programme Guide” books

[tombow]

I browsed an old thread here recently where the “RD Programme Guide” books came up. I had the first one as a kid and borrowed the updated one at some point (I think it got up to series 7 or 8?)

Some people were saying the authors “had weird ideas” about some RD stuff? There were controversial parts? I don’t have my copies anymore, though I remember really loving them at the time, even the A-Z part in the middle.

Topic

[cwickham]

The first edition covered Series I-V. There were three revisions, each adding VI, VII and VIII respectively.

The authors for some reason get very angry about the Smeg Ups, but that’s all the controversy I can recall…

[Ben Paddon]

Why in the name of God’s arse would they get angry about the smeg ups?

[tombow]

I’ve never actually seen smeg ups/outs. For some reason I just kept forgetting to. I guess it’s a piece of RD history I have to get round to.

[Ben Kirkham]

Why in the name of God’s arse would they get angry about the smeg ups?

I got the impression from the books that they found outtakes rather tedious, but that’s just me reading between the lines. They made a sarcastic comment about the Smeg Ups in ‘LIE MODE,’ if I remember correctly.

[si]

The first revised edition had a horrific version of the ellipse, which came to a point. Yowch.

[Ian Symes]

Here’s a sixteen year old child summarising Howarth & Lyons’ Smeg Ups snark, just over 17 years ago: https://www.ganymede.tv/2003/06/smeg-ups-smeg-smeg-off/

[RunawayTrain]

I’ve never actually seen smeg ups/outs. For some reason I just kept forgetting to. I guess it’s a piece of RD history I have to get round to.

Me neither.

Do they contain ones that aren’t on the DVDs?

[tombow]

I think they contain all sorts of footage of the actors messing around on set, from what I’ve read. I’m not sure how much stuff is repeated either.

[tombow]

(after searching round this site it seems most dvd series outakes were taken from smeg ups but smeg ups still has stuff unique to it)

[RunawayTrain]

(after searching round this site it seems most dvd series outakes were taken from smeg ups)

Ooh, so not Smeg Outs? Interesting!

[tombow]

I’m assuming both ups and outs ?

[Dave]

Smeg Ups is more IV-VI era, Smeg Outs more I-III.

[RunawayTrain]

I’m assuming both ups and outs ?

Ah fair enough.

Can anyone tell us for sure whether the Smeg ups/outs contain material (other than the links, of course) that didn’t make it onto the series DVDs?

[Ben Kirkham]

Here’s a sixteen year old child summarising Howarth & Lyons’ Smeg Ups snark, just over 17 years ago: https://www.ganymede.tv/2003/06/smeg-ups-smeg-smeg-off/

What a snotty little twat.

[si]

What a snotty little twat.

Hey, don’t diss the Smegmeister.

[Hamish]

The Smegmeister was decades ago. We’re still far more concerned about the quite silly thing Cappsy said in his Mechocracy review three years ago.

[Dave]

I’m assuming both ups and outs ?

Ah fair enough.
Can anyone tell us for sure whether the Smeg ups/outs contain material (other than the links, of course) that didn’t make it onto the series DVDs?

I haven’t ever done a full comparison but I assume the DVDs are pretty comprehensive.

I still find it weird seeing those I-VI smegups in a different order to they way they appeared on the VHSs, though.

[Ian Symes]

This is so odd – the Smeg Ups and Outs tapes were such a HUGE part of the Red Dwarf oeuvre for anyone who was into the show in the mid 90s that I kind of assume everyone is as familiar with them as they are with some of the actual episodes. But I guess if you came to the show later, they must have slipped through the net. I sense a feature or two coming, as soon as free time becomes a concept that I refamiliarise myself with.

I think I’m right in saying that every single outtake made it on to the main DVD releases eventually. There was a small number (like two or three) that were accidentally omitted from the series-by-series compilations, but they were included on The Bodysnatcher Collection as easter eggs. In terms of the reverse, there are no outtakes from the Series 1-VI DVD compilations that weren’t on the tapes, although there are a few dotted around the big series-specific documentaries.

It is of course a completely different (and in my opinion much more satisfying) experience to see the outtakes formatted and compiled as part of an hour-long programme, with different sections for different types of fluff and linking material in between, rather than just grouped together by series. I’d strongly recommend picking up the Just The Smegs DVD if you can, any Red Dwarf collection feels incomplete without Smeg Ups and Smeg Outs.

Oh, and in addition to the links there are a couple of little bits that didn’t make it onto the main DVDs, both from Smeg Outs – the claymation version of Tongue Tied, and footage from Dimension Jump ’95. And it would be remiss of me if I didn’t point out that there are a small number of cuts to the original tapes on Just The Smegs, to remove out-of-date info on merchandise and competitions – clips available here.

[Quinn: Clochebusters World Champion]

I’m sort of in your boat Ian whereby I was just old enough to be watching Red Dwarf when it wasn’t on air, so things like Six of the Best and the Smeg Ups were the best I could get my hands on for the longest time.

Some of those Smeg Ups (and the tapes themselves) are ingrained in my memory as much as any of the shows are. To the point that I don’t think I’ve ever watched the Smeg Ups on any of the series DVDs because a) I’ve seen them all countless times and b) you’re absolutely right that having them compiled and interspersed with links etc is a much more satisfying why to watch them.

I can’t believe the Tongue Tied or Dimension Jump footage hasn’t appeared elsewhere. I’d have sworn I’d seen them both somewhere, but that just shows how lodged in my mind as part of the Red Dwarf history those things are that I just assume they’ve been used in more than one thing, other than just the Smeg Outs tape/DVD.

[clem]

there are a small number of cuts to the original tapes on Just The Smegs, to remove out-of-date info on merchandise and competitions – clips available here.

I didn’t know about it at the time but that second version of the Smeg Ups tape without the competition was the one I had, so it was a nice surprise to see “Rogue simulants always carry lare lar lare lar lare lar … Ching ching ching!” for the first time on the VI DVD.

There is of course also the Smeg Ups Rough Cut. That has some exclusive smeg ups.

Smeg Outs is a bit of a crap name isn’t it? They should’ve just called it Smeg Ups 2.

[Nick R]

I’m most familiar with the Red Dwarf Night compilation, though I did get to see the VHS Ups and Outs at least once when my friend lent them to me.

I was never sure what the Programme Guide authors had against them either.

I think I’m right in saying that every single outtake made it on to the main DVD releases eventually. There was a small number (like two or three) that were accidentally omitted from the series-by-series compilations, but they were included on The Bodysnatcher Collection as easter eggs.

Was the outtake of Robert Bathurst from The End one of these? I remember the fan speculation was that the reason it didn’t appear on the Series 1 DVD was because he didn’t authorise it; was the real reason just that it was omitted by mistake? Was it intact on Just The Smegs?

I found this thread from 2018, where Pete Part Three says that the Todhunter outtake turned up on Bodysnatcher, and then makes an AMAZING pun a few posts later:

Camille Question

[Ian Symes]

There were no Bathurst outtakes on either Smeg Ups or Smeg Outs, and therefore not on Just The Smegs either – the only place they’ve turned up is in the Series 1 doc on Bodysnatcher. The Series 1 and 2 DVDs didn’t have quite the same level of exclusive rushes footage as the subsequent releases – we got deleted scenes obvs, but no outtakes or stuff used as documentary cutaways that hadn’t previously been released, hence the wait until Bodysnatcher gave them the opportunity to fill in the gaps.

The rumour was that he or his agent had blocked them from being released on Smeg Outs in the first place, but I’m wondering whether it was more a combination of the footage being more interesting than it is funny is its own right (Smeg Ups/Outs were comedy shows first and foremost, whereas the DVDs had a wider remit), and them generally focusing more on the main cast cocking up and not wanting to expose mistakes by guest actors. The Timothy Spall stuff from Back To Reality is very similar – not released in the 90s, only seen as part of the series-specific doc. It’s possibly a combination of all those reasons.

[Ian Symes]

Also, I’ve just looked up what exactly the lost moments were in that Bodysnatcher easter egg, and it was in fact only one smeg up – from Me², Craig corpsing after the Souper line.

[International Debris]

I’ve been a fan since ’92, but other than the Red Dwarf Night compilation, I’ve never seen any of the longform versions. As a kid I didn’t really have the money to buy videos very often, especially once I got into music, and there were always about ten times as many videos as I wanted, so outtakes were never near the top of my list, even if Dwarf was my favourite show. I really should buy Just the Smegs one day. At least in time for the inevitable commentary.

[Flap Jack]

Yes! Just The Smegs is £5.99 new on HMV and Amazon right now, so it’s definitely good value. Smeg Ups and Smeg Outs are also available from iTunes individually, but you don’t get the broadcast version of Smeg Ups with those.

Missed opportunity that Smeg Ups and Smeg Outs weren’t included on the Series 1-VIII Blu ray set, as it’s otherwise so comprehensive. Am I right in thinking the Kryten links weren’t released on their own elsewhere either, or did they turn up in one of the other DVD sets?

It’s interesting how the Smeg Ups VHS was such a big thing for the 90s Dwarf fandom. My first exposure was when it was shown on Dave (probably the broadcast version?) in the pre-Back to Earth era, and I loved it but I didn’t quite twig it had been around for so long.

[Dave]

This is so odd – the Smeg Ups and Outs tapes were such a HUGE part of the Red Dwarf oeuvre for anyone who was into the show in the mid 90s that I kind of assume everyone is as familiar with them as they are with some of the actual episodes.

Yeah, it’s always interesting how different ages/eras of fandom have experienced the show.

I find it equally arresting when people talk about their knowledge of I-VI being patchy because seeing the episodes depended on which of the VHSs were out of print. And then I remember that of *course* that was the only way to get hold of them for a certain period.

[RunawayTrain]

Wow, well all of the above really is a ringing endorsement that these are still an essential part of the canon then!

Incidentally there are loads of VHS copies going for almost nothing on eBay, if that interests anyone. (We do still have a VHS player connected to our TV but for my own watching I find DVDs far more convenient, especially when they have subtitles. You had to have a very snazzy expensive VHS player to be able to record or watch anything with subs!)

[Pete Part Three]

There was also a video on YouTube knocking around with the some “unreleased” Smeg Ups that didn’t make the cut. I assume they’ve since turned up in other places.

Not overly keen on them tbh. I watched Smeg Ups to death because that was the only new merchandise released for Christmas 1994. I have such an over-familiarity with some bloopers, that’s it actually hard not to think of them when watching the show (particularly Series VI). Smeg Outs, meanwhile, was so horrendously padded, that even in 1995 it seemed bargain-bin.

[Dave]

Christmas videos in general are such an odd thing – most of them seem almost overtly designed to be disposable crap, like that’s the whole point.

Still, I imagine the likes of Danny Baker and Johnny Vaughan are pleased they exist.

[Ian Symes]

There was also a video on YouTube knocking around with the some “unreleased” Smeg Ups that didn’t make the cut. I assume they’ve since turned up in other places.

Hello and welcome to the 48th time Ian Symes mentions the origin of Captain Bollocks this year.

[Quinn: Clochebusters World Champion]

Am I right in thinking the Kryten links weren’t released on their own elsewhere either, or did they turn up in one of the other DVD sets?

Almost certain they are only on the Smeg Ups/Outs DVDs. They would make absolutely no sense out of context.

[Ben Kirkham]

This is so odd – the Smeg Ups and Outs tapes were such a HUGE part of the Red Dwarf oeuvre for anyone who was into the show in the mid 90s that I kind of assume everyone is as familiar with them as they are with some of the actual episodes. But I guess if you came to the show later, they must have slipped through the net. I sense a feature or two coming, as soon as free time becomes a concept that I refamiliarise myself with.

I think I’m right in saying that every single outtake made it on to the main DVD releases eventually. There was a small number (like two or three) that were accidentally omitted from the series-by-series compilations, but they were included on The Bodysnatcher Collection as easter eggs. In terms of the reverse, there are no outtakes from the Series 1-VI DVD compilations that weren’t on the tapes, although there are a few dotted around the big series-specific documentaries.
It is of course a completely different (and in my opinion much more satisfying) experience to see the outtakes formatted and compiled as part of an hour-long programme, with different sections for different types of fluff and linking material in between, rather than just grouped together by series. I’d strongly recommend picking up the Just The Smegs DVD if you can, any Red Dwarf collection feels incomplete without Smeg Ups and Smeg Outs.
Oh, and in addition to the links there are a couple of little bits that didn’t make it onto the main DVDs, both from Smeg Outs – the claymation version of Tongue Tied, and footage from Dimension Jump ’95. And it would be remiss of me if I didn’t point out that there are a small number of cuts to the original tapes on Just The Smegs, to remove out-of-date info on merchandise and competitions – clips available here.

I’m interested how the production team actually label what is an outtake and what isn’t. There are certain moments seen in the rushes of the DVD documentaries that could probably class as Smeg Ups. Maybe it’s just judged on humorous content, but the editing of the Smeg Ups and Smeg Outs tapes is a huge part of their success. Watching them neatly presented in series’ order doesn’t quite have the same impact.

[Pete Part Three]

Hello and welcome to the 48th time Ian Symes mentions the origin of Captain Bollocks this year.

That was LAST year.

[Flap Jack]

Almost certain they are only on the Smeg Ups/Outs DVDs. They would make absolutely no sense out of context.

Yeah, I expected so, but given how little was missed off of those DVD sets, it wouldn’t have surprised me if they were snuck in there as an easter egg for Series VI or Bodysnatcher!

[cwickham]

Two hour-long video presentations aren’t really easter eggs.

[Dave]

The Kryten links wouldn’t be that long on their own, though.

[desbug]

I remember finding the smeg ups and smeg outs videos a bit of a slog at the time and not finding them as funny as I had thought I would – except when Kenneth Rimmerams was periodically unleashed by Chris Barrie.

Did it stop me buying them again for my portable playstation when they were released on whatever that odd format was? Of course not.

[tombow]

Two hour-long video presentations aren’t really easter eggs.

have you seen the dvd for Dean Learner (the Alan Partridge style fake chat show with Richard Ayoade?) It has something like a 3 hour low budget sci fi movie tucked away in the extras!

[RunawayTrain]

Got it, recommend it.

I’m so used to seeing bloopers by series on DVD – for any show, not just Red Dwarf – that it didn’t twig until a couple of days ago that the Smeg Ups and Outs were stepping off the ‘Auntie Bloomers’/’It’ll be Alright on the Night’ type of format, but also were the next step, of being from all one show rather than a mix.

I’m not 100% versed in the DVD smeg-ups by series to know if there were definitely any in the Smeg Ups/Outs that weren’t on the main DVDs, but it did seem there were maybe a few seconds of extra footage for some of them that I didn’t recall seeing before, and a couple that weren’t familiar to me. However, although I am obsessive enough, I don’t have the brainpower to go through them all to check! ;) Some of them also seemed to be better picture quality than I recall from the series smeg-ups?

Also enjoyed the character links, just as something I’d not seen before (mostly Kryten but also Lister and some Rimmer) and the footage from DJ 1995.

[Author]

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