December 4, 2018 at 8:40 am #239479
Have you ever noticed a Red Dwarf episode being preoccupied with something, seemingly obliviously and random, that’s not the actual focus of the story? Here are some I catalogued before immediately losing interest in thinking about this after series 4.
Theme: Goldfish shoals nibbling at my toes
The End: I am a fish
Future Echoes: Robot goldfish / Little fishy song
Balance of Power: Trout a la créme / Fished to death
Confidence and Paranoia: Fish rain
Better Than Life: Gone to the same place as me goldfish / Cat orders an aquarium and sings / Half woman, half fish mermaid
Polymorph: Silly old trout / Fish puns
Timeslides: Junior Angler / Luigi’s Fish ‘n’ Chip Emporium
Dimension Jump: Fishing holiday / Smoke me a kipper / Kippers
The End: Chicken soup machine (basis for most recurring chicken references in Red Dwarf) / No, it’s a chicken
Balance of Power: 140,000 rehydratable chickens
Waiting for God: Chicken vindaloo (recurring variant) / Quagaar Warrior
Confidence and Paranoia: Chicken Marengo
Kryten: I think I’ll try the chicken / cleaned the gunk out of the chicken soup machine / Chicken __Nugget
Better Than Life: I’d prefer chicken
Stasis Leak (big time): You should apologise for the chicken / Half man, half chicken / Who’s eating this chicken?
Also prominent in DNA: Turned into a chicken / Boiled chicken ovulations / Changing a mutton vindaloo into a chicken vindaloo
Bodyswap: Sexual organs
– “Why have I got male sexual organs?” / in orbit around the nearest planet
– “It’s the sound you get when you get your sexual organs trapped in something.” / Mimes
– Rimmer shocked by Lister’s schlong
– “You’ve given me breasts.”
Dimension Jump: Salt
– “I’ll be down in the mess with the salt-of-the-earth engineering boys as per usual.”
– Salt, an Epicure’s Delight / Extracts x2
– “Series 4000 mechanoid, am I right? Salt of the Space Corps.”
Back to work.December 4, 2018 at 9:45 am #239482
someone who watched the show for the first time commented on how they like classic American culture, and how it kept popping up in subtle ways, Marilyn Monroe, noir VR games, etcDecember 4, 2018 at 10:42 am #239483
And all the Blade Runner references, before Back to Earth pointed out how influential it was.
Hudzen’s death. The aesthetic of Back to Reality. Nothing else. All the Blade Runner references.December 4, 2018 at 11:48 am #239484
By Jove its holmes
I’m surprised Backwards went with the reverse shit. surely the absolute worst would be reverse vomiting. Also, would a reverse blow-job s u c k for the woman?December 4, 2018 at 12:27 pm #239485
They’ll never top Round The Twist for a reverse-vomit scenario.December 4, 2018 at 1:24 pm #239486
By Jove its holmes
I love Round the Twist.
The poor kid whose just vomited screams “NO, NO, NO!” when Pete picks up the remote.
Pete, Linda and Bronson then simply say “Yes”, “Yes”, “Yes”.December 4, 2018 at 2:20 pm #239488
I always assumed Round the Twist was a boring Byker Grove-style teen drama and would switch off when the theme started. I feel regret.December 4, 2018 at 4:16 pm #239490
Round the Twist used to really unsettle me as a kid. The mix of ‘every day’ and grotesque was so uncomfortably strange.December 4, 2018 at 4:48 pm #239492
Remember the one where Pete has a tiny mouth? Or the boy with extra fingernails growing on his hands? I’m not squeamish when it comes to bloody violence and gore but strange body horror stuff like that really rattles me.December 4, 2018 at 4:58 pm #239494
The one with the mouth is the one that stuck with me the most I think – wasn’t it caused by an evil Santa character or something?
Also I’m sure there was one with some yellow gunk that actually made me sick.December 4, 2018 at 5:33 pm #239497
Yes, the little mouth episode is the one with the wish-granting Santa. Another one that shat me up was the Eerie, Indiana where girls get a beauty treatment that turns their faces into weird doll-like plastic masks. Fucking horrifying.December 4, 2018 at 7:46 pm #239499
I like the microwave pants one.December 4, 2018 at 8:36 pm #239500
Pete Part Three
Round the Twist was brilliant without my pants. I used to love watching that without my pants. I really fancied the second Linda without my pants. I enjoyed staring at her without my pants without my pants.December 4, 2018 at 11:09 pm #239507
By Jove its holmes
In the original Paul Jennings short story, the kid keeps adding “without my shirt” to every sentence.
Another Jennings short story is where a boy gets some wishes and he wishes his favourite young female singer was there. She appears in their Australian lounge room all right… teleported right from the middle of a concert, still holding her microphone! She’ has to be sent back when she starts screaming.December 5, 2018 at 3:03 pm #239537
VIII has the recurring theme of Anal Penetration
Back In The Red
-Starbug goes up a rat’s arse
-“Well, considering what the future has in store for your jacksy, a couple of zillion volts is gonna be easy street”
-Anus Soothe Pile Cream
-That woman who does Rimmer up the arse
-Part 3 ends with Rimmer about to be fucked by a load of homosexual prisoners, who will presumably be doing anal with him
– (When discussing Lister’s guitar) Didn’t you get a clue that time I tried to insert it in you?”
-Archie goes up the Cat’s arse (deleted scene)
-Archie goes up the Captain’s arse (deleted scene)December 5, 2018 at 3:07 pm #239539
So essentially, Red Dwarf is a nod and wink to Rob and Doug’s sexual perversions?
Oh we knew that for years.December 5, 2018 at 3:08 pm #239540
VIII has the recurring theme of being vile and vapid.December 5, 2018 at 5:41 pm #239547
Let’s talk about Series VIII again!
Series VIII is collectively shite but there are episodes in there that are arguably not shite, just very poorly executed.December 5, 2018 at 6:44 pm #239554
>VIII has the recurring theme of being vile and vapid.
Well yeah, but if I were to list every time VIII mentions genitalia, semen, shit, toilets, sex etc. we’d be here all night, and I’m pretty sure nobody would read a list like that anywayDecember 5, 2018 at 7:01 pm #239556
Are toilets or toilet related bodily functions mentioned once in Marooned?
No cheating by looking at the script.December 5, 2018 at 7:53 pm #239558
Dysentery springs to mind.December 6, 2018 at 7:44 pm #239604
I can accept that answer but only in spirit, you lose a point.December 13, 2018 at 10:46 am #240218
VIII and the Recurring Penis
Back In The Red
-Kryten is classified as a woman for his lack of penis
-Rimmer hits his penis with a hammer
-Warden Knot crushes Rimmer’s penis with his bare hands
-Lister cuts some pubes off his penis to sprinkle on Ackerman’s soap
-Kryten creates Archie, a penis
Only The Good…
-Rimmer goes to a parallel universe and looks at his massive penis
What’s up with that? Was Doug just really horny when he was writing all the scripts for VIII or something? Unlike most people on this site I don’t entirely hate VIII, but thinking about it, it’s utterly bizarre that there are so many jokes about sex and toilets and penises etc.December 13, 2018 at 11:08 am #240220
Doug is ultimately responsible, but from the Red Dwarf wiki:
When the time came for Series 8, Naylor hired Alexander to be script editor and oversee all the writing. He also co-wrote the episodes Krytie TV and Pete II. Alexander submitted his own script, RD: Phwoaarr, which was never produced.
The episode was ultimately unproduced as Doug Naylor felt it was a little too inappropriate (in a series already criticized for its lewd tone).December 13, 2018 at 12:20 pm #240223
Yeah, the VIII DVD booklet talks about Phwoaarr.
“Paul Alexander had submitted a first draft of a script with the working title of Phwoaarr. It told of a ship where a new perfume was being tested that was so effective it caused insatiable attraction between those who smelled it- the result being some nocturnal activity between Rimmer and Kochanski, and much subequent Lister jealousy. The tone and content of the story-including sight of piles of nude, dead bodies- was unsurprisingly considered inappropriate.”
To be honest, I don’t see how Doug thought that was any more inappropriate than all the sexual magnetism shit in Back In The Red. I mean, it’s basically the exact same thingDecember 13, 2018 at 6:53 pm #240276
Because of the nudity I guess.December 13, 2018 at 7:07 pm #240277
To be honest, I don’t see how Doug thought that was any more inappropriate than all the sexual magnetism shit in Back In The Red. I mean, it’s basically the exact same thing
The tone and content of the story-including sight of piles of nude, dead bodies– was unsurprisingly considered inappropriate.
Yeah, no idea. Basically the same level of inappropriateness as Back in the Red. Mmhmm.
For real, though, would Phwoaarr have existed alongside the sexual magnetism virus subplot from BITR? Seems more like a Bodysnatcher/Me^2 situation to me.
Thank goodness it didn’t happen, anyway. There was quite enough magical rape and voyeurism in Series VIII as is. We didn’t need an entire episode dedicated to characters not-quite-consensually shagging each other. Respect to Doug for at least having that much sense.December 13, 2018 at 7:39 pm #240294
>Yeah, no idea. Basically the same level of inappropriateness as Back in the Red. Mmhmm.
Well I was imagining it like Samsara, where the dead bodies were skeletons or something. Or maybe they’d just be lying face-down or something so you could only see their bums
Why are all the VIII episodes about sex though? Like surely there must have been some reason behind it, it can’t have been a coincidenceDecember 13, 2018 at 10:54 pm #240330
Why are all the VIII episodes about sex though? Like surely there must have been some reason behind it, it can’t have been a coincidence
I was proposing that Paul Alexander added it into every episode of the series he script-edited because he thought that stuff improved episodes, but there isn’t firm evidence to back up that libel. Lister cutting off his pubes in Krytie TV is such an un-Red-Dwarf thing though, I have to blame the co-writer.December 13, 2018 at 11:14 pm #240331
I thought that in particular was pretty funny, though, and Lister has done similarly disgusting things previously. Definitely not the most egregious example of what we’re talking about, I would sayDecember 14, 2018 at 12:43 am #240332
>I was proposing that Paul Alexander added it into every episode of the series he script-edited because he thought that stuff improved episodes, but there isn’t firm evidence to back up that libel. Lister cutting off his pubes in Krytie TV is such an un-Red-Dwarf thing though, I have to blame the co-writer.
The story behind Krytie TV is a complicated one, so it could have been either of them. According to the VIII scriptbook, Paul wrote the first two drafts, Doug did a third. Everyone involved (Doug and Ed included) thought the script was absolutely shit. About twelve drafts later he showed it to his wife, who told him “It’s stupid, immature, and mostly unfunny.” In response, Doug went off, holed himself up in a hotel for the weekend, threw out 80% of the original script and came up with the appeal subplot etc.
Honestly, that makes me kind of curious as to what exactly was in the earlier drafts of Krytie TV that disgusted everyone and Doug’s wife so much, especially considering the finished episode is still plenty crude and immatureDecember 14, 2018 at 5:29 am #240337
Missing/synthetic body parts
I was going to speculate about the reason for this, but that was getting to a 💩🚽 level of insensitive.
Future Echoes: future Lister’s false arm
Balance of Power: Rimmer’s rogue arm and breast
Thanks for the Memory: broken legs
Queeg: Rimmer’s legs detach
Parallel Universe: Lorraine’s metal nose
Polymorph etc.: Kryten’s groinal attachments
Bodyswap: Rimmer pretends to lose Lister’s arm
The Last Day: Marilyn Monroe droid kit
DNA: Kryten’s detachable heads and hands
Terrorform: Kryten’s legs are crushed beyond repair
Epideme/Nanarchy: Lister’s amputation, false arm and rebuilt body
Krytie TV: Ackerman’s glass eye
Pete: Kryten’s DIY cockDecember 14, 2018 at 8:13 am #240342
Well I was imagining it like Samsara, where the dead bodies were skeletons or something. Or maybe they’d just be lying face-down or something so you could only see their bums
I mean, it’s possible it would have ended up that way, but in my experience if people are describing a skeleton, they say “skeleton”, not “dead body”, and they don’t usually need to explicity say that the skeletons aren’t wearing clothes.
Although even in Samsara the sexually suggestive skeletons were enough to up the DVD rating to 15. The BBC might have been OK with that level, but definitely wouldn’t have been OK with piles of naked, dead arse-cheeks.
Of course, they could have just not shown it or cut around that part, too, so it’s clear the whole story was just too disturbingly sexual and violent.December 14, 2018 at 1:54 pm #240344
Should have thrown out 100% of Krytie TV and just made Appeal or No Deal. If anything, the title would have been prescient.December 14, 2018 at 1:55 pm #240345
>I was going to speculate about the reason for this, but that was getting to a 💩🚽 level of insensitive.
Is Rob Grant Obsessed With Synthetic Body Parts Because He Has A Tiny Cock?December 14, 2018 at 5:04 pm #240346
>I was proposing that Paul Alexander added it into every episode of the series he script-edited because he thought that stuff improved episodes, but there isn’t firm evidence to back up that libel
Actually come to think of it, maybe it is Paul Alexander’s fault there’s so much sex in VIII? Both his VII scripts (Stoke Me A Clipper and Epideme) involve sex in some way (Lister fucks the Queen, and Caroline’s rotting corpse tries to fuck Lister). Whenever Paul is involved, there’s sex. That can’t be a coincidence, surely?December 14, 2018 at 5:17 pm #240347
He does seem the typeDecember 14, 2018 at 9:59 pm #240348
According to the recently updated VIII section of the Complete Guide on TOS, the appeal and guitar strings stuff came from a script Doug wrote called No Strings Attached based on discussions he had with Craig about Craig’s time in prison. That was combined with material from Paul Alexander’s Phwoaarr.December 14, 2018 at 10:47 pm #240349
I wonder what No Strings Attached was like. Incomplete, probably, and still an VIII episode, so it couldn’t have been that good. But income a world without Krytie TV……….December 15, 2018 at 11:54 am #240350
Series IV: Stuff happening to Kryten
Camille – Kryten falls in love with a Pleasure GELF.
DNA – Kryten gets turned into a human.
Justice – Kryten becomes a lawyer.
White Hole – Kryten repairs Talkie Toaster.
Dimension Jump – Kryten becomes human again, and travels back in time and to a parallel universe, all for the opportunity to fuck Ace Rimmmer.
Meltdown – Kryten is conscripted into a wax droid war.December 15, 2018 at 11:56 am #240351
“Rimmmer” is his name, yeah? 3 Ms. Pretty sure that’s right.December 15, 2018 at 12:01 pm #240352
V is a very Rimmer-oriented series, isn’t it? He’s the central character in Holoship, Terrorform and Quarantine, and even in Demons & Angels his low counterpart is the most striking and memorable. Rob and Doug were obviously having fun exploring his character at that point.December 15, 2018 at 1:20 pm #240355
IV had Justice, Dimension Jump and Meltdown that I’d say are Rimmer episodes too, since he drives the plots. Maybe two of those count as more ensemble though, but he’s overtaken Lister in prominence by that point after III made a point of them co-starring.December 15, 2018 at 1:29 pm #240356
I wonder if Kryten’s even overtaken Lister by IV & V, if you counted up screentime and lines. Lots of exposition about super-light-speed particles – tachyons – passing through wormholes and stargates and the like.December 15, 2018 at 3:58 pm #240357
>V is a very Rimmer-oriented series, isn’t it?
Most episodes that aren’t ensemble episodes are Rimmer-oriented, aren’t they? I don’t think Lister ever really gets an episode that’s got him as the central focus. Timeslides, maybe? But even then Rimmer is very prominent in there, and Lister vanishes halfway throughDecember 15, 2018 at 4:47 pm #240358
Thanks For The Memory is arguably more about Lister than Rimmer, I think.
(Also, I’m guessing we’re just talking about the original 36 here, as obviously later you have stuff like Ouroboros.)December 15, 2018 at 5:43 pm #240359
>(Also, I’m guessing we’re just talking about the original 36 here, as obviously later you have stuff like Ouroboros.)
Actually that was just me being an idiot and forgetting that Ouroboros existedDecember 15, 2018 at 11:54 pm #240363
Fathers and Suns and Dear Dave are also very Lister-oriented. As are Epideme and Nanarchy. Also Confidence & Paranoia. And Psirens and Back to Earth, to some extent. And Give & Take. And M-Corp.December 16, 2018 at 12:22 am #240364
Lister feels prominent again in the Starbug series, VIII and the Dave era. Doesn’t feel like he does that much in IV & V, apart from summing up what they’ve all learned today and saving the day in The Inquisitor. I always liked that one for the Lister/Kryten team-up too.December 16, 2018 at 10:54 am #240366
Even ‘Timeslides’, which opens as a Lister episode, ends up being a Rimmer episode.December 16, 2018 at 4:13 pm #240368
Bargain Bin Holly
The End would also be a Lister-centric episode, since he’s the POV for almost the entire episode.
I think its more interesting to see that most episodes are either focused on Lister, Rimmer, and Kryten or are ensemble episodes of the three including Cat; very rarely is it not this.
– White Hole (A stretch but she by herself is a major part of the plot)
– Waiting for God (A stretch but his species at least is a major part of the plot)
– Can of Worms
– The End
– Confidence and Paranoia
– Back to Earth Part III (Possible to argue the entire special but III is the best example)
– Fathers and Suns
– Dear Dave
– Better Than Life
– Dimension Jump
– Meltdown (Possible to argue otherwise but the plot is partially based around and entirely resolved by Rimmer)
– Stoke Me a Clipper
– Only the Good… (Turns into a Rimmer-centric episode by the half-way point)
– The Beginning
– Officer Rimmer
– The Last Day
– D.N.A. (Possible to argue otherwise but he is a major part of the plot)
– Beyond a Joke
– Krytie TV
Lister/Rimmer-centric episodes (Where the plot is almost entirely focused on Lister and Rimmer and/or their interactions with each other)
– Balance of Power
– Thanks for the Memory
– Pete I & II
Lister/Kryten-centric episodes (Same thing but with Kryten instead of Rimmer)
– The Inquisitor
Ensemble episodes (Where all crew are impacted and the plot doesn’t primarily focus on one character exclusively)
– Future Echoes
– Parallel Universe
– Timeslides (Though more focus is given to Lister in the first-half and Rimmer in the second-half)
– Demons & Angels
– Back to Reality
– Gunmen of the Apocalypse
– Emohawk: Polymorph II
– Out of Time
– Tikka to Ride
– Duct Soup
– Back in the Red I, II, & III
– Back to Earth Part II (Since it revolves around the crew exploring the “real world”)
– Give & Take
– Cured (Though it can be argued Cat takes a certain precedence in this episode)
I need a lifeDecember 16, 2018 at 11:40 pm #240370
Great analysis! But you forgot ‘Bodyswap’ for Lister/Rimmer, so you’ll never live that down.December 17, 2018 at 6:48 pm #240491
I think Back To Earth is the only one of the Lister episodes that really deals with Lister the way that the Rimmer episodes deal with Rimmer, though. Getting deep into the psychological aspects of the character, their loneliness, insecurities etc.
Confidence and Paranoia does technically also explore the psychological aspect of Lister, but the way the two of them act makes it hard to believe they’re a part of Lister in any way. They just feel kind of generic and not really characters tied specifically to Lister’s mind. And of course you get the stories about Lister’s childhood in Marooned and Duct Soup, but they’re not really the focus of the episodes and don’t really say much about Lister’s state of mind in the present. I think Lister’s character is explored best in the novels, really. You really get an understanding of how he feels there, and it’s done excellently imoDecember 17, 2018 at 8:36 pm #240520
Lister is a much more grounded character so there’s definitely less to explore – most of the exploration of Rimmer comes from his neuroses in one way or another. There’s definitely a bit of meat to Fathers and Suns though.December 18, 2018 at 11:09 am #240551
Red Dwarf as horror movie according to someone/s on TV Tropes. Occasionally stretching and with omissions (no Back to Reality), but good that the novels are covered.December 18, 2018 at 4:27 pm #240582
The wording of this made me laugh a lot
There’s a good reason he’s considered the most evil character in the entire franchise, which is saying something considering that Adolf Hitler is a semi-recurring character.December 27, 2018 at 4:58 pm #241061
VIII and Days Of The Week
Back In The Red
-“I was hoping for a manicure and a leg wax tomorrow, how about Thursday?”
-“See you on Friday. Incidentally, it’s black tie.”
-“Give me a chance, it’s only Monday!”
-“It replaced the Wednesday night movie.”
-“I have a date with Miss Patricia Carling from Supplies on Saturday night”
-“I did, we’re meeting for drinks on Thursday!”December 28, 2018 at 2:45 am #241101
It might say more about you, bloodteller, that you interpreted Rimmer’s “insert it in you” as being about Lister’s arse.
Because it follows VI’s similar “fridge-free diet” bit, I always assumed the guitar was going in the mouth.
Pop guitar in mouth. Not up the arse.
Maybe this is another of those Bodyswap / Only the Good cock dilemmas?December 28, 2018 at 2:49 am #241102
>Because it follows VI’s similar “fridge-free diet” bit, I always assumed the guitar was going in the mouth.
I thought that bit was about the arse as well…December 28, 2018 at 2:52 am #241103
How the fuck did Rimmer wrench a fridge out of the wall and lift it up anyway?December 28, 2018 at 3:24 am #241105
WarbofrogDecember 28, 2018 at 4:11 am #241106
I always thought he was talking about shoving them up Lister’s arse, as well. But I never cared for the VIII joke, it felt like retreading old ground.December 28, 2018 at 6:28 am #241108
Either or both of those lines might well have been inspired by Basil Fawlty threatening to “insert a large garden gnome in [O’Reilly]”. When he sets off to do so at the end of the episode, it’s pretty clear from the way he’s carrying it and the shape of the gnome’s hat where we’re meant to think he’s gonna shove it.December 28, 2018 at 6:49 am #241109
The “neck end” follow-up could go either way. Since it’s VIII, I can see it being more anal fixation, but the idea of Rimmer struggling to turn Lister around and pull down his pants while wrestling for control of the guitar and then referring to this incident later without shame makes it harder to swallow.December 28, 2018 at 10:40 am #241111
According to the recently updated VIII section of the Complete Guide on TOS
I’m going to take credit for that, because I made a thread on TOS pointing out the VIII section was still living in 2007.December 28, 2018 at 2:41 pm #241112
>The “neck end” follow-up could go either way. Since it’s VIII, I can see it being more anal fixation, but the idea of Rimmer struggling to turn Lister around and pull down his pants while wrestling for control of the guitar and then referring to this incident later without shame makes it harder to swallow.
To be fair, there are a lot of off-screen incidents in Red Dwarf it’s hard to imagine the characters actually doing. Although yeah, it is particularly hard to imagine Rimmer trying to shove a guitar up Lister’s arse. Maybe he tried to do it while he was asleep?December 28, 2018 at 6:44 pm #241115
I’m in the boat of thinking he wasn’t talking literally with either “insert it in me” line, but this is an interesting discussion nonethelessDecember 28, 2018 at 11:09 pm #241147
Most people think it’s the arse, it seems.
Hopefully we find at least one new thing to discuss about Red Dwarf in 2019 too.December 29, 2018 at 12:45 am #241149
Do we ever see Rimmer in a proper explosive rage outside of series 1? That’s the early Rimmer I can imagine lunging at Lister.
“Alphabetti spaghetti” doesn’t have the same force, though it looks like he’s still trying to hold some of it in. The “nooo!” when the mind patch fails in Holoship is pretty weak.
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