Sonic Mania

[Ben Kirkham]

Blah blah blah DRM blah blah Denuvo blah blah. There’s definitely a point to be made there – you should be able to play offline.

But I’ve not heard anyone talk about the game itself yet. I’ve been playing for a couple of days, and I’m really enjoying it. A smart and clever synthesis of the first four games, with a bit of Sonic CD, Sonic 3D and Robotnik’s Mean Bean Machine thrown in for good measure. A bit like being 8 years old again!

Opinions?

Topic

[Jonathan Capps]

I mean, it’s Sonic. I feel like if you’re comfortable with it being weird and often shit (as any true fan would be) then this game can’t fail to make a good impression.

[Dave]

Yeah, there are frustrating parts like in any 3D Sonic game (I find the combat with the large named mech enemies particularly maddening at times due to the way the battles are so unintuitive designed – and sometimes you can suddenly shoot off a surface into water without meaning to and die, like every 3D Sonic ever) but there’s lots to like too.

The designs are nice, the exploration is fun, and the whole game just has a nice relaxing chilled-out vibe for the most part.

[Jonathan Capps]

Good story and performances too! First time a 3D Sonic game hasn’t made me grind my teeth, anyway

[Dave]

And of course, Sonic’s little dance.

[Jonathan Capps]

And of course, Sonic’s little dance.

Yes, the Chaos Emerald dance! And the cutaway every time he catches a fish that I definitely didn’t get bored of.

[Moonlight]

I will now sit my coffee and wait patiently for Moonlight’s 3000 word essay on Sonic Adventure 3.

Sonic Adventure’s Sonic gameplay has the best controls of any 3D Sonic, ten thousand percent, fight me. I can nail the most insane jumps and land within two inches of where I meant to.

Also the spammable spindash, or as I call it, spamdash, is an incredibly fun tool for speedrunning that’s a little like the boost formula if it weren’t automated at all and actually had responsive controls.

I could keep going.

[Ridley]

So is Frontiers Sonic Adventure Mania or Breath of the Wild? Both?

[Warbodog]

Are there any Sonic cartoons that kids like, or would I just regret adding them to the rotation? Only just got her back into Pokemon after some intense Pony months.

[Moonlight]

Sonic X season 3 in the original Japanese is the best Sonic cartoon, don’t @ me. Unfortunately the dub is actively trying to ruin it in every conceivable way. They literally delete major plot points and leave the resulting threads nonsensical, including removing a character death that’s important. I could go on.

[Moonlight]

So is Frontiers Sonic Adventure Mania or Breath of the Wild? Both?

It’s more like an attempted happy medium between Adventure and something like Generations and it works pretty well. They even brought rolling back.

[Warbodog]

* I failed to specify age.

[Dave]

Are there any Sonic cartoons that kids like, or would I just regret adding them to the rotation? Only just got her back into Pokemon after some intense Pony months.

Sonic Boom is quite light and comedy-oriented so works well for younger kids.

[Dave]

Yes, the Chaos Emerald dance!

[Moonlight]

Sonic Boom is quite light and comedy-oriented so works well for younger kids.

I’d probably like Sonic Boom if it had even remotely good writing and I will die on the hill that it sucks.

[Dave]

I haven’t watched that much of it myself but every time I’ve seen it it’s had quite a silly, jokey tone which I like.

I much prefer that than treating the Sonic universe like it’s all hard sci-fi or some Akira-style dystopian epic like those 90s cartoons did.

[Warbodog]

I haven’t watched that much of it myself but every time I’ve seen it it’s had quite a silly, jokey tone which I like.
I much prefer that than treating the Sonic universe like it’s all hard sci-fi or some Akira-style dystopian epic like those 90s cartoons did.

I was prepared to be trolled, but it did the trick, thanks! Better than the 90s Sonic sitcom that I mainly just tolerated for being Sonic.

Sonic the Comic was the best thing ever when I was 9-10 though.

[Dave]

Sonic the Comic was the best thing ever when I was 9-10 though.

Naturally. “The Sonic Terminator” was a masterpiece.

[Jonathan Capps]

Sonic Prime on Netflix is genuinely very good.

[Dave]

I haven’t seen any of that yet, might have to give it a look.

[Ridley]

Amazon should make Mario N Series out of spite.

[Niki Hutchinson]

Well… seeing how we moved on to the Sonic Cartoons talk. 

Speaking as someone who’s grown-up with all of them, here are my views on each one.

Again, these are just my options.

Agree or Disagree with them, but remember… 

Adventures of Sonic The Hedgehog: 
The first of the 3 DiC shows, a wried mix-match of Looney Tune’s set-up/slapstick and 90’s surreal imagery (Though it was made with a few artists from Red & Stimpy) At times, it does look much odder than it is. Kids will love it for Jaleel White’s Sonic, But Older folks will get more of a kick out of Long John Baldry’s Dr. RRRRobotnik !!! (And the many Glorious YouTube Poop’s that have been made from his voice) Also, this one established Sonic’s Love for Chilly Dogs and Robotnik having some lackeys to talk/abuse ;)

Sonic the Hedgehog (aka Satam): 
Often declared as the best Sonic Show, I can say it fits perfectly in the middle of that mid-90’s Kids Adventure/Action shows era. Just above Spider-Man Animated, but below Batman: TAS. It has aged, in quite a few places (Mainly in a lot of Sonic’s dialogue and the tone does go up and down depending on which episodes of the 2 seasons) but it can still be watched and enjoyed by a modern audience. Although I will say, you can see this show as being viewed as underrated on one hand and overrated on the other.

Sonic Underground:
It’s a Dumb show… Sonic has a long-lost brother and sister and forms a band and uses the power of music to take down Robotnik and reunited with their mother to take back their kingdom. It’s a stupid concept, with sloppy execution and with cringe-worthy songs !!! But, with all the said… It’s perfectly harmless. There’s really nothing offensive with in it (More than can be said on how the web searches for other takes on Sonic family relatives !!!) It can be fun to see how odd it can be. Along with hearing Jaleel doing all 3 of the voices of the main characters. In many ways it’s the Marmite of Sonic Cartoons, some love it, some hate and those who love to hate it. One other thing, first show not to have Tails in. But it is Knuckles’s TV debut with the chaos emerald setup.

Sonic X:
Dub or Sub ? I grow-up with the dub version so that’s what I’m gonna go off for here (Probably better going with the sub version. Though you can watch either one much more easily, these days) For a while this series was in-line with the main game’s continuity of the mid-2000s. (Along with Adapting some of them) But as a show, it’s aimed at a younger audience… Sometimes it rises and falls on its one-off filler eps or the longer arc-spanning stories. Along with the look of the whole thing going from pretty good to Oh dear, who directed this one ?!?!? And yes, you will end up hating the whines of Chris Thorndyke. Pretty much a Take it or Leave it one here 

Sonic Boom:
Our first CGI show and it’s a sitcom… Doesn’t sound that promising but it’s much better than it has any right to be !!! Mainly down to it’s cast delivery (Most of which still doing the games to this very day) and giving some actual funny lines to work off. Especially with Mike Pollock as Eggman !!! And while most of the show is doing very sitcom tropes like “Annoying person comes to live with the main character, then pisses them off” most of it is character-driven and works quite well. Not all the jokes land and some are just right clunkers. Plus the animation at times can look stiff and trying to do a lot of what they have already done. But it is a kids’ comedy that relies more on its dialogue and timing than just being Loud, Stupid and in your face !!!

Sonic Prime:
As of writing this, there are only 8 episodes out, however… There’s a lot of good things going on in this show. Having the most thought-out, ongoing story, while still having stand-alone episodes. A much bigger focus on Sonic’s character arc and his friends and really going to town the visuals and action set-peaces. The only issue I have with it, is I don’t think there’s enough substance to make you want to re-watch it after it’s done. But will see soon enough.

So there you go, hope I didn’t bore you lot with this.

Be interesting to hear anybody else views of the shows here.

[Warbodog]

The two early 90s Sonic cartoons were the Rob & Doug Dwarf of their day. I hardly ever saw the serious one, but I found them both bizarre in how they downplayed the game references we surely wanted and just exploited the character with their own generic takes.

Much of Sonic the Comic was also like that, to be fair.

[Moonlight]

I am very disappointed at the love for Sonic Boom I am seeing. I find it ungodly awful.

[Warbodog]

Just above Spider-Man Animated, but below Batman: TAS.

Is that the Spider-Man show that had crazily long-running stream-of-consciousness serials that would be unrecognisable by ‘Chapter XVII’ but apparently still the same story? I was never really into the comic book heroes, but that was classic summer holiday TV.

[Dave]

 Is that the Spider-Man show that had crazily long-running stream-of-consciousness serials that would be unrecognisable by ‘Chapter XVII’ but apparently still the same story? I was never really into the comic book heroes, but that was classic summer holiday TV.

I loved that show. Great theme tune too.

[Dave]

Finally finished Frontiers after playing it on and off for the last few weeks. I had a fun time with it and even enjoyed it enough to reload the ending on Hard mode and fight the secret final boss.

The story is an odd one though, some nice moments and some altogether bizarre ones (like Sage’s song).

Although maybe still not as strange overall as SA2.

[Warbodog]

We’ve moved on to Sonic 2 since S3&K got too hard at Sandopolis. (And I can’t do any blue spheres stages any more, genuinely feels like a wake-up call to deterioration).

Sonic 2 always felt a bit like Red Dwarf II to me, in that it’s obviously technically superior to the first, but I was more attached to the original and got a better vibe from its zones, except Scrap Brain.

I see why it’s a (the?) favourite though, and having to help an inexperienced player get out of trouble / do the underwater bits, I’m getting to see all these unfamiliar basement paths through zones that I won’t have seen since 1994. Aquatic Ruin’s lovely.

[Dave]

Sonic 2 always felt a bit like Red Dwarf II to me, in that it’s obviously technically superior to the first, but I was more attached to the original and got a better vibe from its zones, except Scrap Brain.

I feel the same about the first two Sonics. While Sonic 2 is slick and vibrant and makes lots of improvement on the first game, I feel like it doesn’t quite have the charm of the first one. It might be something to do with the more garish colours.

[Jenuall]

1 has more considered platforming action and less of a dialled up to 11 “gotta go fast” ethos that means it takes the crown for me, although 2 and 3&K are both still fantastic in their own right. I love all of the original Mega Drive trilogy really. 

1 doesn’t really have any zones that I’d ditch if I could (yes I like labyrinth, don’t @ me!) whereas I think the sequels started to have a few more spaces that could have done with a rethink or improvement 

2 100% has the best soundtrack though.

[Flap Jack]

2 100% has the best soundtrack though.

Of course. 2 has the Observation Zone theme.

[Jonathan Capps]

It’s very nice to see love for Sonic 1. It seems these days the received wisdom is it only has three good zones (at best) but this mainly seems to be from people who don’t know what varied pacing is. Sonic 1 is Alien and Sonic 2 is Aliens.

[Future Producer of Series IX – aaaaany day now]

What about the people who don’t like Aliens because it strays too far from the pure horror roots of the original and instead turns into more of an action thriller?

[Jonathan Capps]

What about the people who don’t like Aliens because it strays too far from the pure horror roots of the original and instead turns into more of an action thriller?

I think those people all moved over to sonic.exe videos years ago.

[Warbodog]

It’s very nice to see love for Sonic 1. It seems these days the received wisdom is it only has three good zones (at best) but this mainly seems to be from people who don’t know what varied pacing is.

Future Echoes, Me2 and The End?

Labyrinth Zone is Waiting for God. Idiots hate it and the Cat priest dying is like when you run out of air.

Starlight Zone is the bit where they go outside in Confidence & Paranoia

Scrap Brain Acts 1 & 2 are military grey, Act 3 is ocean grey

Final Zone is the Gazpacho Soup story, Sonic jumping into the air in the ending animation is ‘souper’

Tails and 2-player mode represent the improved camaraderie from series 2 (albeit still with the underlying antagonism of ‘2-player vs’)

Spin dash is Blue Midget/Starbug

The banana is Super Sonic

Kryten is Knuckles? I don’t know

[Jonathan Capps]

Superb.

[Dave]

[Jenuall]

Knuckles punching the emeralds out of Sonic at the start of Angel Island is the bar room brawl from Backwards 

[Dave]

Knuckles punching the emeralds out of Sonic at the start of Angel Island is the bar room brawl from Backwards 

[Jenuall]

Love it!

[Niki Hutchinson]

You… Giving me an idea with this Dave.

You’ll see soon ;)

[Dave]

Intrigued!

[Niki Hutchinson]

Intrigued!

Well, here it is !!!

(Will upload a public version of this very soon…)

[Dave]

Brilliant.

[Moonlight]

Sonic Adventure and Sonic 2 are my favorite Sonic games, probably, followed by Adventure 2 and Mania. Although if we’re counting exclusively the Sonic-style gameplay I’d have a harder time ranking the Adventures.

I also have a sweet spot for Sonic 1 despite how rough around the edges it is. It gets SO MUCH right on the first try.

Triple Trouble 16-Bit is the true Sonic 4. Or maybe it’s Sonic Adventure.

[Warbodog]

Someone gave me the cheat codes for Sonic 1 & 2 quite early on, so I didn’t have motivation to complete Sonic 2 properly after that, it was always a zone pick ‘n’ mix. I still liked to play through Sonic 1 properly a lot though (probably easier), and filled out the S3&K save slots several times when the cartridge wiped to make sure I had the full spectrum of character and non/super/hyper states for pointless posterity.

[Niki Hutchinson]

Here’s the finished thing to the folks online !!! 

[Warbodog]

[Moonlight]

For some reason the video become super dark when I uploaded it.

[Ridley]

I was expecting the spring noise.

[Moonlight]

That would have made sense, but I threw this together in five seconds and was focused on the actual idea I had which was the death.

[Author]

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