Home Forums Ganymede & Titan Forum Things about Red Dwarf that make you irrationally angry

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  • #235063
    GlenTokyo
    Participant

    I’ve just been going through some Red Dwarf and rewatching bits and bobs and I was reminded of all the things about Red Dwarf that make me irrationally angry.

    Red Dwarf VII is particularly bad for this, although overall I think it’s not bad at all and is sometimes some of the better post Rob Red Dwarf and I’m usually quite kind to it, but what the actual fuck.

    Absolute cluster fuck haha.. how big is Starbug supposed to be? 200% expansion or whatever right? So if that’s everywhere that’ll be why they’ve made the windows smaller. Seems about right, they’re probably half the size as before, but the air lock door is the same size, and not only that, in Xtended they stuck another door on that makes Starbug look even smaller than it did originally.

    Don’t even get me started on the landing bay that, even if you subscribe to the opinion that Starbug has changed size in a TARDIS like dimensional anomaly sci-fi fashion like me, has no outer access. It doesn’t even fit with the outer shape of the ship considering it has to be in the top of the ship, so it’s either where the engine cut out is, where the bunkrooms are, or where the cockpit is. Which it obviously isn’t. Sort it out Doug man.

    Also why so many ducts. Whoever designed that craft is a cretin. Get a Aircon engineer to go over the design and it’ll be palacial. Fuck me, miles of 6×4 foot ducting in a shuttle.

    Time drive, I’m with that bloke that complained to Ed.

    Sure, it’s made up, but if we care about it, shouldn’t the people that make it? Obviously the convention attendee was a bit of a dick if he wasn’t fictional, but he’s got a point.

    In fact I don’t like VII anymore. I’m just angry about it now.

    What are some things about Red Dwarf that make you irrationally angry?

    Fans ranting on the internet? Craig saying every series is some of their best work despite at least one series being utter shite? People that call Back to Earth series IX even though it patently isn’t? The fact that the Emohawk gave the Cat free dental work and a new hairdo and nobody said anything?

    #235064
    Warbodog
    Participant

    Remastered was offensive. Especially since the deletion of the not-even-that-old 1-6 video releases (which may even have been unrelated?) made it feel like a permanent replacement, despite Doug explicitly saying it wasn’t on the later documentary.

    On the bright side, it was an excuse to rerun series 1-3 on BBC2, which I hadn’t even seen most of at the time (but was still annoyed I wasn’t seeing the originals of, obviously).

    Is remastered still the standard for foreign language audiences, like the Czech Republic and Japan? I guess the new HD remaster will replace those, and maybe they’ll find the undone changes weird and bothersome after so long?

    #235065
    flanl3
    Participant

    Timewave, and the IX thing. And [insert random G&T admin or former admin that I’d like to insult tonight here].

    #235066
    flanl3
    Participant

    It’s going to be John Hoare.

    John Hoare makes me irrationally angry.

    #235067
    Warbodog
    Participant

    Not angry, but some things that have always made me cringe or feel uncomfortable pre-VII (not counting budget-excusable effects and such):

    – Kryten singing the ‘Androids’ theme
    – Kryten saying “smee heeeeeeeee” in Quarantine
    – Kryten in Marooned, but that’s taken as read
    – Human-Kryten laughing in DNA and the laugh echoing, gave me an actual chill the first couple of times
    – The serious talking-over-each-other bit at the start of DNA, before Cat saves it
    – The no-effort waitress in Backwards
    – Emile Charles being an unconvincing Lister in Timeslides, but that’s probably general too
    – I feel sorry for Gandhi in Meltdown
    – Duane Dibbley in Emohawk, obv

    #235068
    Warbodog
    Participant

    + Dog and Arlene Rimmer. I forgot about Parallel Universe, because I consider it VIII tier.

    #235069
    Dave
    Participant

    People who don’t realise that Back To Earth is Series IX.

    #235070
    Pete Part Three
    Participant

    I’m watching Red Dwarf VIII at the moment. I now can’t remember a time when I wasn’t angry about this show.

    #235071
    bloodteller
    Blocked

    The Red Dwarf Shuffle from Backwards makes me cringe

    #235072
    Jawscvmcdia
    Blocked

    >I’m watching Red Dwarf VIII at the moment. I now can’t remember a time when I wasn’t angry about this show.

    Which episode?

    #235073

    The general fan reaction to Timewave; it’s mediocre but its not as bad as people want to believe it is.

    Whenever someone approaches Doug Naylor’s work with the mindset it’ll be shittier cause Rob Grant isn’t involved. That pigheadedness gets old real quick.

    #235074
    Dave
    Participant

    The Red Dwarf Shuffle from Backwards makes me cringe

    It’s funny, there’s loads of stuff in the show that can feel a bit naff for adult viewers, but which plays completely differently when you watch it with a younger audience.

    I watch Red Dwarf quite a lot with my kids now, and we just watched Backwards again a few nights ago – they loved the Red Dwarf Shuffle bit, and it made me think that it actually puts a nice cap on the scene of Lister and Cat being stupid and being so pleased with themselves about it.

    Similarly, my daughter’s most-requested episodes are Parallel Universe (so she can watch Tongue Tied) and Back To Reality for the slapstick car chase hallucination bit (which I don’t think anyone thinks is bad, but which is a bit more in the direction of broad physical comedy than the show usually goes). “Speed bumps” always has her in stitches.

    #235075
    clem
    Participant

    The Series IX thing.

    > The fact that the Emohawk gave the Cat free dental work and a new hairdo and nobody said anything?

    I’ve seen this mentioned a few times, and Rimmer transforming into Ace as well, but nobody asks where Rimmer’s facial hair comes from in Polymorph. Is he meant to have stuck on a little false beard to go with the glasses and pipe etc?

    #235077
    Warbodog
    Participant

    >Rimmer’s facial hair

    He’s a hologram who can order hairstyles etc. at will. The stupid thing in Polymorph is how the Polymorph works on a hologram. Sucked his light bee, I guess.

    >Kids watching Red Dwarf say the funniest things

    My eight-year-old brother screamed with laughter when the Grim Reaper showed up in Only the Good. He only found Kryten’s period banner mildly amusing though, explaining that the joke was “it’s supposed to be ‘Have a Fantastic Present.'”

    #235078
    clem
    Participant

    Of course, he’s still soft light in Polymorph so I guess he must have asked Holly to make him look like that. Or she did it for her own amusement.

    #235079
    clem
    Participant

    Sorry Warbodog. Posted before I saw your reply.

    #235080
    clem
    Participant

    “it’s supposed to be ‘Have a Fantastic Present.’”

    Excellent. Doesn’t he ask what the tampon is though?

    #235081
    bloodteller
    Blocked

    bad FX shots always annoy me. the awful VII CGI starbug is the worst offender, since it appears in every fucking episode even when they evidently had plenty of lovely model shots they could’ve used instead (see the extras on the VII DVD) Also the majority of the Remastered CGI shots. absolutely awful.

    other annoying FX shots include the External Enforcer in Emohawk, the dinosaur crashing through the wall leaving a dinosaur-shaped hole in Pete Part 2 and the shot of the Canaries approaching the Manny Celeste in Pete Part 1 too- it doesn’t look bad, but they’ve plastered a big ugly unnecessary caption over the shot that gives exposition that Kryten literally explains 2 seconds later anyway. also that one in Krysis where they head towards the SIU station. would’ve been fine but the starfield background they used is a pain to look at

    #235082
    bloodteller
    Blocked

    the moon greenscreen in Timewave is shit, too. why does it look that bad?

    #235083
    Warbodog
    Participant

    That was in 1999, so difficult to check now. I watched a lot of adult comedy at that age too and much of it will have gone over my head. The Day Today was on when I was 8, but the only parts of that I really got and enjoyed were Peter O’hanrahahanrahan’s name and a news report about a helicopter pilot losing control and almost hitting “a field of children looking for worms” and “an old woman up a stick,” I loved the phrasing of it and whispered it to my friend in assembly on Monday through stifled giggles.

    #235084
    Pete Part Three
    Participant

    > “Speed bumps” always has her in stitches.

    I *hate* that Robert slightly stands for this bit, rather than bouncing like the rest of them. I also hate that the Cat Priest moves his leg after dying in Waiting For God, and that Craig clearly re-positions himself on the medibed so he can collapse comfortably when Kryten injects him in Polymorph.

    #235085
    Pete Part Three
    Participant

    Fuck the actors, is what I’m saying. Art is pain.

    #235086
    curtis
    Participant

    Kryten calling himself ‘2X4C’ in Beyond a Joke.

    #235087
    Taiwan Tony
    Participant

    Back to Reality coming top of everything and Johnny Vegas. (Though I feel this is rational.)

    #235088
    Dave
    Participant

    Kids watching Red Dwarf say the funniest things

    That wasn’t really how my post was meant to come across. I didn’t mean to be a bore in that way.

    I was just trying to say that the show works on lots of different levels and different audiences with different tastes/ages will find different things to enjoy in it.

    Anything vaguely rude or complicated goes over my kids’ heads so it tends to be the silly and slapstick stuff that works for them.

    #235089
    Warbodog
    Participant

    I started out replying in the same vein, then warped the conversation to my own ends for the second time this thread.

    #235090
    Ian Symes
    Keymaster

    The general fan reaction to Timewave; it’s mediocre but its not as bad as people want to believe it is.

    People who belittle fellow fans’ opinions, or assume some sort of motive behind them, just because they disagree with them.

    #235093
    flanl3
    Participant

    I am much more fine with people calling Back to Earth the ninth series than “series IX”, one is a debatably correct trait and the other is an incorrect name.

    I typically can’t stand people who claim that “modern Red Dwarf is just a parody of itself”, but it makes me angry that I have to concede that if I were making a parody of Red Dwarf, especially modern Red Dwarf, it would probably look quite a bit like Timewave.

    #235096

    <block quote> I *hate* that Robert slightly stands for this bit, rather than bouncing like the rest of them. I also hate that the Cat Priest moves his leg after dying in Waiting For God, and that Craig clearly re-positions himself on the medibed so he can collapse comfortably when Kryten injects him in Polymorph

    High Kryten not being dragged far enough behind the boxes in the cargo bay so you can see Robert move his leg to stand up

    #235097
    Pete Part Three
    Participant

    I say Red Dwarf IX, you say Back to Earth.

    Let’s call the whole thing off.

    (As they should have done, during pre-production)

    #235098

    Ace and Dwayne Dibbley in Emohawk. Most of VIII, although the Blue Midget dance and Reservoir Dogs in particular. Stardisbug in VII. People thinking Tikka to Ride is actually a watchable episode.

    #235099
    GlenTokyo
    Participant

    Carbug was utter shite and the fact that so many people like it just says it all.

    #235100

    People who belittle fellow fans’ opinions, or assume some sort of motive behind them, just because they disagree with them.

    U wot m8

    #235101
    Ben Saunders
    Participant

    >Kryten singing the Androids theme
    Why?!
    >Human-Kryten laughing in DNA and the laugh echoing, gave me an actual chill the first couple of times
    Lmao

    >Kryten calling himself ‘2X4C’ in Beyond a Joke.
    That really is beyond a fucking joke. It was written -by- Kryten!

    The Polymorph affecting a soft-light hologram in III has always been questionable to me. Did his lightbee just happen to be in the perfect position at that moment? Tikka to Ride is more than watchable, it’s one of the best episodes.

    When I was young my brother showed me Only The Good after downloading it from Limewire, playing it in Windows Movie Player. He skipped over the fantastic period bit because I was 8 or something and he thought I shouldn’t see that bit. He probably unknowingly made me appreciate the joke more because by the time I actually saw that part I was old enough to know why it was funny. A lot of stuff in Red Dwarf I just sort of take for granted because I watched it so much as a kid that it’s burned into my consciousness, I think.

    As far as things that annoy me, probably people who act as if VII and VIII have absolutely -no- redeeming qualities, or are just blatantly not funny across the board. I’m not going to say they have some sort of agenda that makes them say these things, I just don’t agree. Also people criticising the “we’ve got to stop them” bit in Krytie TV for being offensive, and people treating Lister like some moral paragon who can/should do no wrong, because of one or two speeches in Series IV.

    Also the Epideme voice. Ugh.

    #235102
    Ben Saunders
    Participant

    Although the “pouring blue stuff on things in tight white jeans” line had me baffled until we discussed it on here earlier in the year, so much so that at one point I thought period blood must be blue (because of the misconception that blood is blue in your veins until exposed to air)

    #235103

    people treating Lister like some moral paragon who can/should do no wrong

    People would flip their shit if Timeslides happened today. Lister wiping Kryten, Cat, and his people from existence is arguably a wee bit worse than Lister being the bystander of a woman falling into an airlock and pressing the eject button.

    #235104

    Correction – Kryten still exists he’s just marooned on the Nova-5 again

    #235106
    Pete Part Three
    Participant

    >He probably unknowingly made me appreciate the joke more because by the time I actually saw that part I was old enough to know why it was funny.

    I’m suddenly saddened that I didn’t watch Only the Good in the short period of my adolescence between not understanding the joke, and understanding the joke and finding it infantile.

    >People would flip their shit if Timeslides happened today.

    The only thing that people would “flip their shit” about Timeslides now, is the casual retcon of Rimmer’s death. Cat not existing for ten minutes because Lister didn’t think that far ahead, doesn’t really compare to the casual indifference he shows when a shittily written female character is killed off.

    #235109
    bloodteller
    Blocked

    >Also people criticising the “we’ve got to stop them” bit in Krytie TV for being offensive

    People were offended by that? I thought it was really funny tbh

    >people treating Lister like some moral paragon who can/should do no wrong, because of one or two speeches in Series IV.

    True- people complaining about some of his more cruel behaviour (e.g. Entangled) ought to note that in Me2 he happily eats popcorn and sniggers at a video of the entire crew’s death, which is borderline sociopathic. He also states in VI the only reason he isn’t allowing Kryten to commit suicide is because he doesn’t want to have to do his own laundry, which is rather nasty.

    The ending to Entangled is still shit, mind you. I just don’t think it’s that out-of-character.

    #235110

    Cat not existing for ten minutes because Lister didn’t think that far ahead, doesn’t really compare to the casual indifference he shows when a shittily written female character is killed off.

    Well here’s the thing, the reason Lister did what he did cause he didn’t think far ahead is an assumption that’s never made clear in the episode. What is made clear is Lister is being selfish and completely self-centered to the point he’d steal a guy’s invention so he could bugger off to his mansion and extinguish his Cuban cigars in ashtrays of Om. In the end he doesn’t face any consequences for this, so really Lister was a complete cunt the entire episode and got off scot-free. Still a funny episode tho.

    #235111

    Plus had Rimmer not done something Cat would’ve not existed for all eternity, a bit longer than ten minutes mind you.

    #235114
    Plastic Percy
    Participant

    Kryten’s fall from the gantry in ‘Camille’.

    In the first shot it looks rubbish because only his legs are sticking over the edge of the gantry slightly, then in the next shot he’s clearly standing on a black box and rather limply holding onto a piece of railing. At no point does it look like he’s holding on for dear life.

    #235138
    Pete Part Three
    Participant

    Shit editing. Just watched Cassandra. There’s a bit where Rimmer says “No way, No way am I joining the Canaries”, and there’s a rubbish attempt at a “You’ll never get me on that bicycle” smash-cut as a badly executed edit abruptly shows the crew in a row in Canary uniforms. It’s so badly done that I checked the deleted scenes and was not remotely surprised that there was additional dialogue after this.

    #235139

    To be fair, Lister behaves that way because he’s exceptionally depressed at being practically alone in the universe and is desperate to get something resembling a life back. I think most people would do the same.

    In Entangled he watches a woman die without showing even a hint of remorse or even interest. For no particular reason. They’re different situations.

    Also, his character is very clearly developed to become much more sympathetic over the course of the show, which is why later examples of him being a cunt are more jarring and uncomfortable. I always found the ‘I’m not going my own smegging laundry’ line a bit difficult, but at the same time I think it’s at least partially jokey anyway.

    #235141
    Ben Saunders
    Participant

    I didn’t intend to start another debate about the ending of Entangled lmao, I think we can all agree that that particular moment is at least a bit shit. I was talking more in general, with the “we’ve got to stop him” scene being one I do remember specifically.

    Another anti-Lister being a good man is swallowing Rimmer at the end of Meltdown, which comes immediately after one of his big moral speeches interestingly enough. You could argue that Rimmer deserved it, if you wanted to.

    #235142
    bloodteller
    Blocked

    Rimmer did deserve it- he had just wiped out the population of an entire planet, killing hundreds of innocent people, and yet didn’t show even the slightest bit of remorse over it.

    #235143
    Dave
    Participant

    Although arguably his personality was warped by Lister chewing his light bee in the first place.

    #235145
    (deleted)
    Participant

    People who are still incandescent about VII and VIII, and the idea that somebody might enjoy them, 20+ years later even though there have been 21 new episodes since with the exact U-turn in tone/style that they begged for.

    #235146
    bloodteller
    Blocked

    Spitonawrist makes me pretty angry

    #235154

    Spitonawrist makes me pretty angry

    That would be pretty irrational

    #235155
    clem
    Participant

    Jokes-wise it’s the feeble “Sister” Talia misunderstanding that really blackens my shite.

    #235156
    Moonlight
    Participant

    Where the fuck is the Series X nameplate shot supposed to show? That’s CLEARLY not the front of the ship.

    #235158
    GlenTokyo
    Participant

    >Where the fuck is the Series X nameplate shot supposed to show? That’s CLEARLY not the front of the ship.

    Oh God. Don’t get me started on Dave Dwarf model shots. That, the tiny Starbug legs, the absent engines from the full ship bigature (which would be fine if they didn’t do shots where you should be able to see the engines and can’t), the paintjob on Starbug, the new Starbug in general.

    #235160
    Moonlight
    Participant

    The Dave model shoots really come across as haphazard and amateur.

    #235171

    Despite the huge disappointment of the Dave model shots, only two aspects of them fully bother me: the really bad lighting, and that weird nameplate bigature thing.

    #235173
    bloodteller
    Blocked

    >Where the fuck is the Series X nameplate shot supposed to show? That’s CLEARLY not the front of the ship.

    Yes it is, that’s why there’s the nameplate on it

    #235174
    GlenTokyo
    Participant

    Unless Red Dwarf is a Borg cube, that’s not the front of Red Dwarf.

    #235175
    Warbodog
    Participant

    Calling the Space Corps ‘Star Fleet’ and Rimmer being a third technician in Last Human are very annoying, but only when I’m actually reading the book once every 20 years. It’s such basic stuff that I can’t fathom how Doug could forget what he/Rob created, or why he’d deliberately change Space Corps to something less distinctive and already popularly baggsied by Star Trek.

    #235178
    bloodteller
    Blocked

    >Unless Red Dwarf is a Borg cube, that’s not the front of Red Dwarf.

    why not? i’m not trying to be obtuse or anything, i just genuinely don’t see the problem people have with it. it’s clearly meant to be the front of the ship, given the massive nameplate “Red Dwarf”which exists nowhere else on the ship.

    #235180
    Ben Saunders
    Participant

    It’s too flat and doesn’t really look like the other model

    #235181
    Pete Part Three
    Participant

    #235182
    GlenTokyo
    Participant

    >why not? i’m not trying to be obtuse or anything, i just genuinely don’t see the problem people have with it. it’s clearly meant to be the front of the ship, given the massive nameplate “Red Dwarf”which exists nowhere else on the ship.

    I don’t think anyone doubts that it’s supposed to be the front of the ship, it’s just that it so obviously isn’t. It’s like if I bought 3 footballs, painted them green, stuck them together and wrote Starbug on the side, we know it’s supposed to be Starbug, but it isn’t.

    It’s obviously a big rectangle, and given the size of the nameplate on the model (quite small), you would be able to see the tapezoid shape of the nose cone of Red Dwarf if it were correctly scaled.

    #235183

    i’m not trying to be obtuse or anything, i just genuinely don’t see the problem people have with it. it’s clearly meant to be the front of the ship

    How??

    #235184
    GlenTokyo
    Participant

    Is how it would need to look (assuming that code works) for it to believably be the front of the ship, and that’s before you even get in to the complete lack of matching greebling around it.

    #235199
    tombow
    Participant

    i wish when Lister lost his arm at the end of XII they gave him the robot arm

    #235207

    Calling the Space Corps ‘Star Fleet’ and Rimmer being a third technician in Last Human are very annoying

    How many kilograms of bricks did you shit when Rimmer said ‘Star Fleet’ in Back to Earth?

    #235211
    tombow
    Participant

    Cat always has bowl hair when it is not gelled up. His teeth naturally stick out but he always wears a brace to keep them in. And, he always carries practical clothes because deep down he knows he may need them. When Polymorph bites him, he messes his hair down, takes the brace out and gets changed.

    #235212
    Warbodog
    Participant

    >How many kilograms of bricks did you shit when Rimmer said ‘Star Fleet’ in Back to Earth?

    Somehow didn’t notice that being off. ‘Lord’ makes it sound like he’s talking about some different, elite, possibly made-up organisation to the Space Corps we’ve seen, whereas Last Human just used Space Corps/Star Fleet interchangeably (I think). It was back to Space Corps by Trojan anyway.

    Hollister also mentions the ‘Space Federation’ during the Back in the Red trial, whatever that means. That should probably annoy me too, but it’s in Back in the Red so it doesn’t stand a chance.

    #235214

    >Cat always has bowl hair when it is not gelled up. His teeth naturally stick out but he always wears a brace to keep them in. And, he always carries practical clothes because deep down he knows he may need them. When Polymorph bites him, he messes his hair down, takes the brace out and gets changed.

    Where do his canines go though?

    #235215
    Dave
    Participant

    If Cat has canines, does Dog from Parallel Universe have felines?

    #235217

    >If Cat has canines, does Dog from Parallel Universe have felines?

    Here’s something that annoys me (Not makes me irrationally angry tho), whenever in the early scenes they had another felis sapien that wasn’t the Cat they never gave them canines. The Cat Priest and the Cat-Polymorph, the Priest gets away with it cause maybe they fell out from old age but the Cat-Polymorph I never even knew was a felis sapien till I read Better Than Life.

    #235218

    *early episodes

    #235219
    Ridley
    Participant

    >Where do his canines go though?

    Calcium Heaven

    #235223
    Lily
    Participant

    >Cat-Polymorph I never even knew was a felis sapien

    Wait. What?

    #235226
    Dave
    Participant

    In the show, I don’t think she is.

    #235228
    GlenTokyo
    Participant

    Frances Barber? Didn’t even know she was supposed to be a cat. Thought she was just an attractive woman.

    #235336
    Moonlight
    Participant

    I don’t think she was supposed to be a cat.

    #235340
    Pete Part Three
    Participant

    >the Cat-Polymorph I never even knew was a felis sapien till I read Better Than Life.

    Not sure how you reached that conclusion. She’s described as a “girl” in Better Than Life.

    #235358
    Hamish
    Participant

    So does the Polymorph lack imagination or does Cat just prefer things cross-species?

    #235359
    Jawscvmcdia
    Blocked

    “That pays for the hat, now what about the insult?”
    “Okay, you’re a fat, bearded git with breath… [LAUGHS]”

    #235381

    So does the Polymorph lack imagination or does Cat just prefer things cross-species?

    Given his being attracted to other human women (plus the scene in the Backwards novel), I don’t think he’s fussed. But it’s also worth pointing out that nowhere is Genny Mutant ever described as <i>human</i>. In my head she’s a cat.

    #235382

    Cat wanted to fuck Lister at one point, plus he thought the Simulant in Justice was Barbara Bellini

    #235391
    Moonlight
    Participant

    He took back that wanting to fuck Lister as soon as he realized it was Lister, so I don’t think it counts.

    #235401
    Paul Muller
    Participant

    [IMG]http://i67.tinypic.com/20kofn9.jpg[/IMG]

    #235403
    Paul Muller
    Participant

    1. G&T having an edit button on their forum posts which doesn’t actually let you edit the post.

    2. My continued inability to properly post Red Dwarf related images on this forum.

    3. Realising after 25-odd years that the original Red Dwarf model was completely assymetrical, with only one name plate.

    4. Series VIII

    #235404
    Dax101
    Participant

    The images code is

    #235405
    Dax101
    Participant
    #235423
    Hamish
    Participant

    > The images code is

    …a source of endless frustration.

    #235425
    GlenTokyo
    Participant

    <ïmg src=”whatever.jpg”> innit? But with a normal “I” obviously.

    #235427
    Ben Saunders
    Participant

    >He took back that wanting to fuck Lister as soon as he realized it was Lister, so I don’t think it counts.
    That’s a nice excuse.

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