What did you prefer, Series 1-2 sets or the latter Series onwards?

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  • #1815

    Tonguetied

    Some say Series 1-2 sets were the best, others disagree and claim that they prefered the sets of later series. We know that the early series sets were dirt cheap, they look as though they were going to fall apart; That the colours were too dull. However I believe that these sets really gave the early shows that certain atmosphere which I certainly missed in later series. The colours gave it a very monotonous look sure, but hey this is a big mining ship, not a luxury space cruiser. It gave it a sense of greatness. Lister and Rimmer’s bunkroom had a great design, as did the other rooms seen in the first two series. Later series, did have great designs, but I felt it was missing something that the earlier series had. The simple clean look which I felt should have been retained. Sure it was cheap, but hey, some things in life don’t cost much to be great. Anyway tell me your views, which do you prefer, or are you indifferent?

    #124089

    Jonathan Capps

    G&T Admin

    Series 1 and 2 sets cost the same as the series III sets onwards.

    Ad for the topic… I think I prefer the later sets more. Series 1 and 2 do a great job of giving the atmosphere of a dank, life sapping, procedural mining ship, but the later inventiveness of Mel Bibby manages to give a much nicer contrast with nice, clean Officer’s Quarters and some brilliant dank and dark engine rooms and the like.

    That and series 1 and 2 *is* too gray.

    #124092

    Tonguetied

    Yeah I know, same cost, different designer, Mel Bibby, radically different way of design. I liked the Officers quarters, if it were used more for scenes with Rimmer and Lister. However as you know, the actors did not particulary like one another, and rehearsing those bunk scenes was a major problem. They just weren’t used that much Jonathan. Sure in series 3 there were some gems, like the Wilma scene with Cat and Lister. The frog description by Rimmer. The whole scoffing at night scene in bodyswap and some others. However after that, come series 4 and 5 while the boys were still on the dwarf, the officers quarters were used less and less, until it became more corridor based look at the Inquisitor. However thanks for your comment.

    #124095

    Jonathan Capps

    G&T Admin

    I’m not sure if you’re trying to prove my opinion wrong, or just win a competition for regurgitating as much documentary information as possible…

    #124097

    Tonguetied

    lol I sure love the doccos Johnathan. But no I think we are all entitled to our own opinions, and I think you have valid arguments. It’s just I feel that the officers quarters could have been used more. Like the early series, which would have been great. However I agree with you about the whole contrast the sets had with each other. Mel Bibby is a very very talented designer. Paul was great too I feel.

    #124098

    Jason aka Smeg4Brains

    I see what you mean about the bunkrooms. My favourite bits of the first two series are when a story is being told just to build up to one big laugh (Eg. Lister’s ‘Smart Shoes’ story and Rimmer’s ‘Lemming’ story).

    #124099

    Tonguetied

    Yeah It feels more homely, less of the danger that was heavily focused on in later series. Just those two talking bollocks, it was when dwarf was a two man gig, I love that aspect.

    #124100

    Jason aka Smeg4Brains

    And when Holly was senile not just a prat.

    #124104

    Tonguetied

    Haha, good old Norman. Yeah when he became a she, Hattie came in etc. I agree the whole character was different, less practical jokes on Lister, like the Norweb federation. Change of actor made Rob and Doug write the part for her rather than retain the personality established in the earlier series. However Hattie did have her moments, even though she was a prat some of the time, like the fall when she sees Ace and when she acts up in White Hole.Most of the time though she just wasn’t the same, dialogue was obviously different, because there were just too many characters,lines had to be shared, Kryten became the expositionial man, the man of reason, while Cat was given the more dumbfounded lines that Holly would usually had.The solution in series VI was sensible, to get rid of her. Then come Series VIII, the whole problem started again, the Cat became a background character. Still Norman did shine when he had the chance in series VIII.And of course it was back to the senile familiar holly we had known in series 1 and 2.

    #124101

    Jason aka Smeg4Brains

    I still dont think he was the same in VII and VIII. They tried to hard to make him senile and he just ended up being stupid.

    #124102

    Tonguetied

    I see what you mean, he should have been brought in earlier in series VII, or at least have him more in Nanarchy. His awrite dudes was great though when he materialized at the end. but I liked the whole become a dog strategy for Lister. His try not to get crushed to death in Back in the Red extended. He should have been better written to hark back to the glory years. I love how the mirror on the early sets in Listers bunkroom doubled as a viewscreen.

    #124107

    Jason aka Smeg4Brains

    I’m not saying that he couldn’t be funny in VII and VIII but it just didn’t seem like the same Holly we all know and love……not in a homo-erotic way.

    #124108

    Tonguetied

    Yeah more senile holly, that’s what would have made series VIII miles better. Not that it doesn’t have it’s moments mind you.

    #124109

    Tonguetied

    Where are you from Smeg4Brains, and how long have you been in the Red Dwarf posse lol?

    #124110

    Jason aka Smeg4Brains

    I’m 18 and I’ve been watching Red Dwarf from an early age…probably from around series VI. I think that may be why I have more tolerance for the later series, because that’s what I grew up watching.

    And I’m from Rotherham (near Sheffield)

    #124114

    performingmonkey

    I think the sets managed to match each series perfectly. Sure, the sheer greyness of the series 1 sets and the, let’s face it, crapness of the props don’t make the show particularly appealing to a viewer, but the strength of the show shines through in that you soon get sucked in and forget about these things. The episodes worked very much like dialogue-driven two/three-handers which could have been performed on a stage with a black cloth background and it would still have been great.

    The funniest sets are in series 2 where it’s basically the grey 1 sets but with various bits of COLOUR (in capital letters) thrown on. Also, the Observation Dome set…classic. It reminds you of dodgy ’80s BBC chroma key, which can only be a good thing.

    What you have to keep reminding yourself is that this is a SITCOM! The sets were amazing for a sitcom, especially when they brought the corridor in (which to me never seems like they’re running up and down the same one)

    #124115

    Danny Stephenson

    G&T Admin

    > the Observation Dome set?classic. It reminds you of dodgy ?80s BBC chroma key, which can only be a good thing.

    Ah, the old “background stays the same, regardless of camera angles”. Bless them.

    #124118

    Baz

    Loved the music in the background of that scene. Sometimes just put the DVD in to listen to it (searches for soundtrack CDs so far proving fruitless).

    Also has the best line of series 2

    Cat- Aaaaaaooooow! I am so hungry, I’ve just gotta eat!
    Lister- Shhh! Rimmer’s Dad’s died.
    Cat- Well, I’d prefer chicken.

    Also the “Rubber Nuclear Weapons” reference later on in the bunkroom, priceless.

    I personally prefer the first two series, I think the writing was so much sharper. Perhaps I’m just being nostalgic.

    #124285

    Tonguetied

    Yes my fellow dwarfers, the Observation Dome set was grossly under used, it’s criminal frankly. One of the best sets ever created for Dwarf.

    #124300

    Seb Patrick

    >(searches for soundtrack CDs so far proving fruitless)

    *cough* I’ve never made one of those.

    Ever.

    #124301

    Danny Stephenson

    G&T Admin

    Yes, you have, you made the…

    *SLAP*

    *sits back in corner*

    #124312

    Jonathan Capps

    G&T Admin

    “Ted, what about that ?200 you won on the horses?”

    #124313

    Seb Patrick

    “Actually, Ted, I forgot you had the money. I was just going to say, your flies are undone.”

    #124296

    Jonathan Capps

    G&T Admin

    Damn, I’m misquoted.

    #124319

    Danny Stephenson

    G&T Admin

    “once again, you’ve made me look a complete idiot in front of REAL people… Thank you so much…”

    #124323

    performingmonkey

    > ?once again, you?ve made me look a complete idiot in front of REAL people? Thank you so much??

    That’s the perfect line to say to your girlfriend after a night out.

    #124342

    mick

    Yes my fellow dwarfers, the Observation Dome set was grossly under used

    Probably for fear of legal recourse as it’s a blatent rip off of the observation dome in the final few episodes of Battlestar Galactica (original series) hehe ;)

    #124348

    Andrew

    I think you’ll find Dark Star got there ahead of them…

    #124359

    mick_aka v2beta

    Bit of a tough one to call that as Glen Larson had been actively trying to get Battlestar Galactica off the ground since the late 1960’s.
    I also know for a fact that one of the scripts featuring the Observation dome was written when he was working on The Six Million Dollar Man which would have been in 1973, so he would have at least had no prior knowledge of the Observation Dome on Darkstar.

    #124362

    Andrew

    Doesn’t matter who had the idea first, it’s who got it out into the popular culture earliest – we’re only talking about cultral influence. And when it comes to influence on Dwarf, Dark Star’s clearly the daddy.

    #124363

    mick

    we?re only talking about cultral influence

    Are we? I jokingly sugested it was for fear legal recourse, neither that or the following posts read to me like we were debating either shows cultural influence or that on Red Dwarf.

    Of course I concede that Darkstar had more influence on the show.
    Aside from the model shots which bare stiking resemblances (see shuttle crashing in ‘The Gun on Ice Planet Zero’) Im willing to wager Battlestar Galactica had virtually no influence at all on Red Dwarf.

    As for cultural influences, well I wont get into that in any depth (perhaps a face to face debate at DJ) but I find very very small ammounts of comedy of sci-fi fans even ‘get’ Darkstar let alone find it ammusing, where as Battlestar Galactica was a massive influence on everyone at a time where it was widely viewed as a TV version of Star Wars.
    I think the Darkstar phenomenon to a certain point comes down to its cult status and the masses of annoying little barstuards wo instantly suscribe to anything with that status attached to it.

    A great example of this is Donnie Darko, I forced loads of people to watch it and all but a few proclaimed it to be shit, until of couse it was given ‘cult’ status then everyone thinks its the best thing since double ply arse wipes.

    I still think Darkstar is terrible, it still puts me to sleep and I have never even once grinned at any of the ‘humour’ contained in it, despite me being a huge fan of both that sort of comedy and the work of John Carpenter.

    #124364

    Danny Stephenson

    G&T Admin

    I thought Donnie Darko was an awesome film. I’d not heard anythign abotu it beforehand which is unusual for me, because i usually read up on a film before i start to engage in it.

    #124365

    Andrew

    > Are we? I jokingly sugested it was for fear legal recourse, neither that or the following posts read to me like we were debating either shows cultural influence or that on Red Dwarf.

    Surely the joke that it was a rip-off from Galactica stems from the suggestion that one work of popular culture affected the other?

    I think you just wanted to show off some “Galactica had a scripted Obs Dome dontcha know” triva… :-)

    #124366

    mick

    Not really I mentioned it to about a dozen people at DJ in bedford, all of whom post here, although I think you were all too busy watching my piling pizza on symes and drawing on his face ;)

    #124369

    Andrew

    > although I think you were all too busy watching my piling pizza on symes and drawing on his face ;)

    Well who WOULDN’T want to watch that?! :-)

    #124370

    Danny Stephenson

    G&T Admin

    > although I think you were all too busy watching my piling pizza on symes and drawing on his face ;)

    What? Pissed Pizza Jenga? I won the ‘spoon balancing on Ian’s nose’ competition!

    #124375

    Baz

    I am so going to have to attend DJ this year…

    #124378

    mick

    > I won the ?spoon balancing on Ian?s nose? competition!

    You certainly did not!

    #124353

    Danny Stephenson

    G&T Admin

    *cries*

    #124354

    mick

    *laughs*

    #124355

    Phil

    *felches*

    #124385

    Phil

    *felches*

    #124392

    Danny Stephenson

    G&T Admin

    Do you still have the picture from that glorious night, Mick?

    #124395

    mick

    Oooooooh yes.

    #124425

    Danny Stephenson

    G&T Admin

    Still got your brick(s)?

    #124426

    Jonathan Capps

    G&T Admin

    I think now would be an appropriate juncture to state that I love my brick.

    #124427

    Danny Stephenson

    G&T Admin

    NAAAAAAAAAAAAAH! FED UP WITH BREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK!

    #124428

    mick

    > Still got your brick(s)?

    Yep, one in the car, three in the garage :D

    #124429

    Jonathan Capps

    G&T Admin

    > one in the car, three in the garage

    The new Murder-Rom-Com from Richard Curtis, there.

    #124450

    Dave

    I never really had a preference regarding sets aboard Red Dwarf.

    But I was quite proprietorial about Starbug. I love Starbug. The set was never better than in Series VI. Series VII’s alterations really lessoned the impact of the ship and undermined the story.

    #229151

    Jawscvmcdia

    I must admit I have a soft spot for the Series 1 set, but I think had it been developed further it would have been quite effective in terms of portraying a battered mining ship. I also think the Series 8 sets were also pretty good, a nice amalgamation of both the early series and later series sets.

    #229156

    Pete Part Three

    Jawscvmcdia commenting on a TongueTied thread. Two worlds collide.

    #229157

    PFMC84

    S5 Starbug interior looked great, if they was kept but with the extra seating in the cockpit it would have looked brilliant I think, but wouldn’t have fit in with the overall theme of the series of a long passage of time, the ship falling into disrepair etc.

    #229160

    International Debris

    1 & 2 sets are my favourite.

    #229165

    Dollar Pound

    i done the lounge up like the starbug midsection circa series vi, the kitchen series iii/iv and grey in the bedroom. just depends what i’m doing i guess. how has everyone else done their yachts?

    #229182

    RamesesNiblickTheThird

    III to V sets no question. Then I and II. I love the lighting in the new era and the detail but that’s about it.

    #229183

    quinn_drummer

    The new sets a little too modern / futuristic aren’t they? I don’t think there would have been any shame in keeping the sets looking a bit out dated. It meant to be a big industrial mining ship, not a high tech space craft.

    I appreciate they are suffering the same fate as Star Trek, where modern technology has caught up with the tech shown on screen in some cases, but it is a comedy, and the little knowing nods to things like using VHS in the future are quite nice. Star Trek needs to look flash and advanced, Red Dwarf doesn’t and never really did. It should look like an oil rig in space.

    It can afford to look a little more old a decrepit, that’s part of it’s charm. It doesn’t need to look sharp. Other ships they discover can, and should, but not Red Dwarf.

    Thats not to say they don’t look fantastic, just that it’s unnecessary IMO. Starbug for example has had so many updates over the years it’s gone from a crappy little ship to surface vessel to a full blown intersetella space craft in its own right.

    #229190

    Ben Saunders

    I like them all. Why do we need to fight?

    There’s something incredibly homely about the old military/ocean grey I sets. I actually preferred them before they chucked bananas and shit all over the walls to give it a bit of colour. Series III i quite homely too but the Dwarf seems to get progressively less inviting and more rundown and cold as we go on and on. I love the camaraderie and adventure of VI and VII but know I wouldn’t want to live entirely on Starbug. I used to love the look of VIII but now it just looks like overlit sets, X was a bit ugly and XI and XII are too damn dark.

    #229194

    bloodteller

    i like the Series I sets the best, they really do make it feel like it’s actually taking place on quite a large mining ship, which is something you never really quite feel in the later series. plus the basic grey walls and the simplicity of the Drive Room sets feel like the type of thing you actually would see in the future-with how small technology is getting, it makes more sense that you’d only need a tiny little room to control a huge ship

    plus the Series I sets don’t have school dinner trays plastered over absolutely fucking everything, which is something that really started to look a bit weird, especially in VIII and XI. what are the dinner trays for? are they just decorative wall items, or is meant to be some tech thing that’s part of the ship?

    #229196

    quinn_drummer

    I believe the dinner tray thing is to give the walls some shape and texture, which is crazy as you’d just create flat walls as far as you can. If there has to be anything behind them, you wouldn’t wind the wall in and out around it, you’d just make it slightly deeper and have a flat wall. I’m sure there’s reason for it looking better on camera or something, but it make no logical sense

    #229197

    Katydid

    Because flat, matte walls wouldn’t look nearly as interesting? And the only reason you even notice them as being dinner trays is because they explicitly explained as much on We’re Smegged.

    #229199

    Ben Saunders

    I feel like the ship felt biggest in IV, possibly II thanks to the elevator. The obvious re-use of one corridor in V makes it all feel like it takes place on one floor and th-thank modern series’ all take place in two or three rooms.

    Back to Earth is cheating.

    #229200

    Ben Saunders

    and the modern series’*

    #229201

    bloodteller

    III also makes the ship feel fairly big imo, there’s loads of different areas of the ship seen in it. the huge gantry areas and the sauna used in Bodyswap, as well as the cargo bay in Polymorph really sell it to you that it’s a big place

    lots of different areas of the ship in VIII as well but they’re somehow just not quite as convincing. they also try to do a big cargo bay in Pete but it’s not really very good and at one point a random bloke just wanders into frame seemingly unaware that there’s filming going on

    #229202

    Ben Saunders

    Oh now you mention it VIII does make the ship seem pretty big, with the big reveal shots of the prison thing and the cargo deck. It doesn’t make the ship feel like anywhere I’d want to be, though. I-IV do, V-XII don’t.

    #229203

    Warbodog

    Are there people who prefer the two-hander, character-driven style of I & II but wish they’d had the Mel Bibby sets back then? Or who prefer the ensemble, antics-driven style of III-V but wish they’d kept the Montague sets? It seems to be part and parcel of the era you like best (or saw first?), down to the preferred Holly. Or I could just be speaking for myself, as I probably prefer III-V by all metrics.

    Since the new series aren’t polluted by nostalgia, I prefer X’s warm, reddy sets to XI/XII’s cold blue dinginess, but maybe that’s more of a lighting issue.

    #229204

    Ben Saunders

    I saw Series One first and those are my favourite sets and that is my favourite Holly. But I like the action oriented III-VI stories the most. There are aspects of every (yes, every) series I like, however. Whether or not I’d prefer to have the One/Two sets in III-IV, I couldn’t possibly answer, as the sets used in a series are such a large part of said series’ identity. Rimmer writing his notes all over his body in the III bunkroom doesn’t look right in my head, but of course it would if that was the way it had always been. V couldn’t be done on the Series One sets, imo, the atmosphere and lighting gets so much darker at that point.

    #229215

    International Debris

    I would have preferred them to gradually update the look at the show went on, rather than going with the rather jarring contrast between 2 & III. And I wish IV onwards had more dialogue based, less actiony plots. I don’t necessarily think either is better than the other, but a gradual blend of the two would be lovely.

    #229243

    quinn_drummer

    Given they move from their quarters to the officers quarters, it’s easy to accept the change in style as just being a different part of the shop. Especially as, canonically, Lister’s bunk is still the same in Back in the Red.

    #229244

    Ben Saunders

    Abandon shop

    This is not a daffodil

    #229247

    bloodteller

    >Given they move from their quarters to the officers quarters, it’s easy to accept the change in style as just being a different part of the shop

    i think this is stated in one of the books- when lister first arrives on Red Dwarf, he notices the whole place is a huge mashup of different styles due to the decades it took them to build the ship.

    #229253

    Lily

    I just presumed it was nicer because of rank. Officers get swish white rooms, third level technicians get plain grey ones.

    Although as the bunk rooms have gotten bigger over the years they make increasingly less sense. Most people would prefer to have a smaller room privately, than an enormous room they have to share. The amount of space taken by the bunk-suite in XI/XII could be used by two double bedrooms quite easily.

    #229255

    International Debris

    Given they move from their quarters to the officers quarters, it’s easy to accept the change in style as just being a different part of the shop.

    Oh yeah, it definitely makes sense in-universe. I’d just prefer a gradual change as a viewer.

    #229312

    Plastic Percy

    The guide on the Red Dwarf website, apparently taken from an extract from the corporate publicity video, mentions that the officer quarters are deliberately more luxurious than the technician quarters as there’s no reason for the high-fliers to slum it.

    I figured that the Boys from the Dwarf have customised the new sleeping quarters extensively and that it might have been a large storeroom previously. Or that it’s the equivalent of the Officer’s Quarters in the rebuilt Dwarf, with the red colour being a holdover from the colour coding used in I & II – White Corridor 159 etc.

    #229314

    Lily

    It’s kinda sweet in a slight slash-fic way that in all these years and with a spaceship five miles long, it’s never occurred to them to have separate bedrooms.

    #229569

    Firsty

    Except in Me2.

    #229570

    bloodteller

    to be fair, you wouldn’t really want to live in a room on your own, would you? they keep each other company and stuff, and they’re the only two people onboard the ship who realistically can share a room together- Kryten’s always busy cleaning and stuff, and Cat is too selfish to share a room with anyone (plus lister gets sick of the cat after spending like an hour with him in Samsara).

    or maybe the two of them are gay for each other, I don’t know.

    #229571

    Hamish

    They could just become, you know, neighbours or something.

    #229575

    bloodteller

    but that wouldn’t be nearly as interesting

    #229584

    flanl3

    What do you use the second bunk for?

    #229585

    bloodteller

    >What do you use the second bunk for?

    i stayed at a hotel once that had a bunk bed, and whoever had used it last had put a load of danish pastries in the second bunk. so maybe thats it

    #229587

    International Debris

    In my head, they spent time apart living in other rooms / floors / areas of the ship, and ended up realising that being alone was even worse than being together.

    #229658

    Hamish

    As someone who does have a bunk bed, I can assure that the correct answer to the question of “what do you use the second bunk for?” is in fact: Cats.

    #230607

    Gelfbride

    My first episode of RD was in 1991 or so, so I am pretty certain series 4. We were students I was 18 and we all stopped partying to watch the weekly episode and it was explained to me about a cat who evolved. Regardless, I loved it- it reminded me of star trek meets the young ones. Life went hard and then I didn’t see another episode till partwat thru Series 7- Kochanski was banging the pipes and begging for cottage cheese with pineapple chunks so in essence, that was my first real expereince. which I loved… watched it all,each week waiting for the next episode. and then purchased the remainder on DVD to watch and so to go back to 1-2 seemed so… out dated. I now watch them all and gain greater insight and enjoyment each time,
    I prefer 1-2 over the more recent ones, I didn’t like Krytie TV and was a bit – meh, and the stupid part of my brain didnt like Chloes’ longer hair so stupid those things bug me.

    #230608

    bloodteller

    >the stupid part of my brain didnt like Chloes’ longer hair so stupid those things bug me.

    i also found it kind of weird how they couldn’t be bothered to keep her hair how it was in Series 7 tbh

    #230610

    International Debris

    Of all the continuity errors in Red Dwarf, the change in Kochanski’s appearance between VII and VIII annoys me more than most.

    #230611

    Dax101

    Series 8 tried to be a reinvention in many ways.

    Who know the Ship had about 20 starbugs and blue midgets onboard… only series 8.

    #230618

    bloodteller

    >Who know the Ship had about 20 starbugs and blue midgets onboard… only series 8

    in XI/XII they use Starbug 19, and they use multiple Starbugs in Backwards and Terrorform

    #230626

    Ben Saunders

    Original ship design, as well. They’ve definitely gone through a number of ‘bugs and ‘dgets over the series, though

    #230629

    Unrumble

    Given their general lack of concern with continuity, plus the amount Chloe moans on about her hair in the VII commentary, I doubt anyone was fussed about her hair looking different.

    #230630

    Plastic Percy

    She looks very different. Her hair is longer, a lighter colour and she’s also lost a quite noticeable amount of weight.

    Across the series, I think they destroy five Starbugs, three of which in III alone.

    #230631

    Dave

    More than that, surely?

    Off the top of my head there’s Backwards, Marooned, Bodyswap, Terrorform, Out Of Time, Back In The Red Part One…

    And that’s discounting major crashes and repairs like Dimension Jump, Emohawk, Gunmen and Twentica.

    #230632

    Ben Saunders

    >Out of Time
    Two Starbugs get blown up in Out of Time but also no Starbugs get blown up in Out of Time.
    I don’t want to think about that one too hard.

    #230635

    Hamish

    Am I the only one feeling a bit meh that it is the appearance of the one female cast member that we are holding to such a high degree of continuity?

    #230636

    Taiwan Tony

    Chris’s wig and Bobby’s stomach received similar traction. Not sure if they were continuity based complaints, though.
    Lister’s accent bugged me more. And it was better for the comedy when he was screechier.

    #230639

    Ben Saunders

    The more i think about it the more i realise just how different she looks between 7 and 8. i mean, i notice before, but yeah, it’s pretty stark.

    The next biggest change in appearance from Nanarchy-BitR would be Kryten suddenly losing those incredibly defined lines on his face, i think. Now I’m going to have to watch it again to see how everything else changes.

    #230640

    International Debris

    Am I the only one feeling a bit meh that it is the appearance of the one female cast member that we are holding to such a high degree of continuity?

    It’s the fact that Nanarchy and Back in the Red are quite clearly set on the same day that bugs me – especially as the other three are pretty much the same in appearance, same outfit, same hair style. If the series were set a few months apart I wouldn’t have had a second thought about it, but it appears to be a matter of minutes between her last scene in VII and first scene in VIII and she practically looks like a different person.

    I also find the disparity between the Starbug bays in the ‘mini Starbug’ reveal shots in both episodes equally frustrating.

    #230650

    Me Own Stunts

    > Off the top of my head there’s Backwards, Marooned, Bodyswap, Terrorform, Out Of Time, Back In The Red Part One…

    I thought we were seeing the same Starbug crashing each time, not new ones. There’s even a line about it crashing more times than a ZX81.

    #230652

    Warbodog

    >I thought we were seeing the same Starbug crashing each time, not new ones. There’s even a line about it crashing more times than a ZX81.

    Maybe they salvaged some or all of the crashed Starbugs and painstakingly repaired them, but it feels like they’re leaving them behind. Then Holly or Kryten flies another Starbug into that convenient landing bay the guys like to use and Rimmer insists the Skutters repaint its registration ‘1’, even though that doesn’t matter.

    #230653

    Me Own Stunts

    > it feels like they’re leaving them behind.

    It never even crossed my mind that they were doing anything other than constantly reusing the same Starbug, repairing it offscreen when necessary.

    #230654

    Warbodog

    I never really thought about it, but I know I had a sense of potentially endless replaceable Starbugs before we saw the fleet in VIII.

    I remember first seeing that Psirens “crashed more times than a ZX81” line as the caption to a Starbug pic in either the Programme Guide or a Smegazine, and I interpreted it as a dig about all the Starbugs they get through. I didn’t see the episode until a couple of years later, where the line’s specifically about the VI ‘Bug and how hard-wearing it is, so different from what I was thinking.

    #230655

    International Debris

    I assumed at least a couple were left behind, particularly the Backwards one and the completely fucked one in Bodyswap. There are obviously more Starbugs than just one, given that there are two in those particular episodes.

    #230657

    Ben Saunders

    I’m certain they leave behind the Marooned one as well.

    #230658

    Dave

    And in Terrorform.

    #230659

    bloodteller

    i think it’s mentioned as early as Backwards that there’s multiple Starbugs, isn’t it? Kryten mentions he took all his flying lessons in “Starbug 2” and so isn’t used to the controls in Starbug 1.

    #230662

    Dave

    I think the question is at what point we found out there were more than two, ie. an entire fleet of them – like you say, there have been at least two ever since the ship was introduced.

    #230663

    Dax101

    Well they got rid of the landing pad shot at the end of series 7 so in the series 8 redo of that sequence they show 5 starbugs in a row just to show us there isn’t just one.

    #230667

    Me Own Stunts

    > there have been at least two ever since the ship was introduced.

    I’ve never doubted this. The presence of the number 1 and 2 on various model shots also conveyed that there were at least 2. I just never imagined that there was a much more vast supply, and that whenever they crashed a Starbug they simply abandoned it, got another Starbug off the rack and painted that replacement with STARBUG 1.

    I think I just prefer the sense of continuity of them using mostly one Starbug, and that when it crashed they restored and repaired it offscreen. It’s not a big deal, but it’s what I assumed and took for granted. When there were loads of Starbugs and Blue Midgets at the end of series 8 I put it down to series 8 being shit.

    #230669

    International Debris

    I fall somewhere between the two camps: I always assumed they probably had a few of each – a ship that size, they’ve got to have more than three shuttle craft – but the amount seen in Only the Good… doesn’t work for me either.

    That said, you’d imagine there would be regulations about lifeboats in order to get everybody off the ship.

    #230735

    Plastic Percy

    <<Off the top of my head there’s Backwards, Marooned, Bodyswap, Terrorform, Out Of Time, Back In The Red Part One…>>

    That’s the five I’m counting, as the others we see them repaired and made to fly again. As stated, Out of Time doesn’t really count as the timeline is undone and it and the crew are restored in Tikka to Ride.

    <<That said, you’d imagine there would be regulations about lifeboats in order to get everybody off the ship.>>

    Apparently not, given they have to abandon the inmates on Floor 13.

    #230753

    International Debris

    I think it’s fair to say Rog and Doub really should have written the JMC operations and regulations manual before starting to write the show itself, it would have saved them from making all these mistakes.

    #230814

    Katydid

    I can’t take this ambiguity. I’m going to track down Starbug and tell him I’m never watching Red Dwarf again.

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