Home Forums Ganymede & Titan Forum A question for Andrew Ellard

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  • #6128
    Seb Patrick
    Keymaster

    If and when Doug starts properly writing some new Dwarf (if he hasn’t already), can you start an email conversation with him about the writing process, i.e. be the Benjamin Cook to his RTD, and get us a Red Dwarf: The Writer’s Tale book out for Christmas? Thank you bye.

    #108156
    hummingbird
    Participant

    I second that.

    #108158
    Seb Patrick
    Keymaster

    I’ve also sent Iain Lee an email asking if he’ll do Shindiggery: The Writer’s Tale.

    #108159
    redhead85
    Participant

    I’m loving that idea. I shall snuggle up with it on the sofa being most inappropriate.

    #108162
    Andrew
    Participant

    Would be good, wouldn’t it?

    But I don’t think it’d happen. RTD’s a wide-open kind of personality, whereas Doug – like a lot of writers – is pretty private about his process.

    #108167
    Danny Stephenson
    Keymaster

    Yeah, but HE doesn’t have to know you’re logging his e-mails does he?

    Until the books out in the shop of course, but then it’s too late for him to do anything about it, then isn’t it?

    We understand how the cogs turn, and get a cracking good read.

    #108175
    Carlito
    Participant

    Doug: It just… popped in there.

    Andrew: What, Doug? What “just popped in” there?

    Doug: I tried to think of the most harmless thing. Something that could never destroy Red Dwarf. Something I loved from series VIII.

    Andrew: What is it?

    Thud. Thud. Thud.

    Doug: … it’s Pete part 3.

    #108192

    I lol’d. I lol’d muchly.

    #108194
    Danny Stephenson
    Keymaster

    Doug: It just? popped in there.

    Andrew: What, Doug? What ?just popped in? there?

    Doug: I tried to think of the most harmless thing. Something that could never destroy Red Dwarf. Something I loved from series VIII.

    Andrew: What is it?

    Thud. Thud. Thud.

    Doug: ? it?s Pete part 3.

    Venkman: “Hey!!! No-one eats cow vindaloo, and then eats two and a half tons of mint-choc ice cream, followed by four hundred crates of orange ice-pops, and swills the whole thing down with two thousand gallons of a popular fizzy drink in my town…”

    #108196

    Speaking about Ghostbusters, it’s been on Watch, or whatever the channel’s called, on Saturday for like three weeks in a row, hasn’t it? I might be wrong and it might just be my brother putting it on every time he’s round, which IS every Saturday… Either way, I’m not complaining, I love that film, and I don’t get why some people HATE the second one. I thought it was just as good. Then again, I thought that about Superman 2 when I was a kid, and it’s been pointed out to me by various people that it is, for the most part, incredibly boring. I won’t go back and watch it again to see, though, I want to be delusional in my memories no matter how out of touch they might be.

    #108198
    Blisschick
    Participant

    >it?s been pointed out to me by various people that it is, for the most part, incredibly boring. I won?t go back and watch it again to see, though, I want to be delusional in my memories no matter how out of touch they might be.

    I thought it was just me. I’m glad to find it’s not.

    #108202
    Tarka Dal
    Participant

    Except in Bedford Falls it was always Saturday night.

    #108205
    Carlito
    Participant

    I love Ghostbusters 2 equally to the first film. I understand WHY people criticize it; yes, it is a near scene-by-scene rehash in some ways, but I just love the shit out of the premise and the characters (and the performers). The Ghostbusters movies are jointly my favourite movies of all time. It’s one of those rare franchises where I can turn my critical analysis filter off and just love the shit out of them.

    I think the upcoming G3 (crap working title, eh?) will be heading to the top of my favourite movies list even if it sucks.

    #108208
    Tarka Dal
    Participant

    Indeed, unless it does end up featuring Vai, Satriani and Petrucci.

    #108212
    pfm
    Participant

    Yeah GB2 is still a great movie, just not as funny or essential as the first (being a perfect movie it was never gonna come close to it), but come on it could have been a LOT worse. Peter MacNicol was so good as Janosz, he saved those parts of the movie from being really dire, which they well could have been, and obviously some people still think they are.

    It has some good individual scenes, they even kept the horror element with some like the slime going into the bath attacking Dana and the baby. I can’t be the only one who still, er I mean used to find the ‘Wiiiiiiinstoooon’ voice when they’re on the underground line freaky. And when they’re in the dark room looking at the pics of Vigo, that’s another creepy scene. Thinking about it it definitely WAS scarier than the first!

    It’ll be interesting to see if there are ANY genuinely scary moments in GB3. If there aren’t any they will have failed. Also if they don’t give Venkman enough to do, which they didn’t in GB2 and it’s rumoured Murray, Ramis et al had a fall out over the script for this reason.

    I watched the double video with both movies sooooo many times when I was a kid so I suppose that helped me love GB2 just as much. I remember only wanting to watch GB2 sometimes…

    #108214

    “And when they?re in the dark room looking at the pics of Vigo, that?s another creepy scene. Thinking about it it definitely WAS scarier than the first!”

    Yeah I had nightmares for quite a while after that, and I’m probably going to get them again now, but it’s so worth it, I love being afraid, though it’s not that hard to scare me. Throw on any music from either The 7th Guest or the 11th hour and I’ll be pissing myself. George Sanger is a psychotically talented man (AND versatile, he did the old original series Star Trek game music AND Loom AND…and many more! Does everyone already know this?)

    #108226
    p2p_productions
    Participant

    I’m a pretty big Superman fan and have always preferred ‘II’ to ‘The Movie’, though I think they’re both great. I remember, years ago, a Film Studies tutor of mine tried to argue that the third film was the best in the series… :-/ Even so, TBH, I’d still put III and IV above Returns on the ‘watchability’ scale.

    And yeah, GB II = Pretty Good. IMO, the first film was a knockout – the second (while there are moments of greatness: River of Slime, Vigo, etc.) just doesn’t quite hit the same level of greatness. Too much, too soon, perhaps..? Trying too hard to appeal to wide audiences..? Who knows. Anyway, here’s hoping GB III will fare better…

    …Pic above not by me, BTW.

    #108227
    Pete Part Three
    Participant

    That pic is awesome.

    There’s far too much hate about Ghostbusters II. It’s far better than the standard of sequels we get these days. It may be by the numbers, but it’s enjoyable enough. And Bill Murray’s in it.

    #108228
    Andrew
    Participant

    > There?s far too much hate about Ghostbusters II.

    Indeed. Just going by the ‘good joke’ ratio, it deserves a better rep.

    I also prefer Superman II to The Movie, though it’s close. And the Donner cut complicates matters significantly…

    #108233

    “And Bill Murray?s in it.”

    Thinking about it, that’s probably the deciding difference between GB2 and MIB2.

    Oh yeah and regarding for the original question posed in this thread, wasn’t the introduction to the Red Dwarf Series 8 script book a BIT like a mini-Writer’s Tale? I can’t really remember, I remember flicking through it in Waterstones but I couldn’t afford it at the time seeing as I was barely at the age where people have fully functioning personalities. But the closest thing I have to a point is; if Doug isn’t going to do a Writer’s Tale-type book, at least we have those introductions to the series 8 scripts. Even if you don’t like VIII, the intros are interesting if I’m remembering properly.

    #108234
    Seb Patrick
    Keymaster

    Ghostbusters II isn’t anywhere near as good as the first but is still a cut above most things in its genre. And as far as set-pieces go, the courtroom scene matches anything in the first film. “Do… Ray… EGON!”

    I’m in a minority among comic book geeks for not liking Superman II as much as the original, but where the original is just about perfect (save the stupid ending… an ending which was actually originally Superman II’s, anyway) there are more flaws in the second. But there’s also plenty of awesome. And I do reckon, having seen the Donner cut, that the “proper” version would have been better.

    #108236
    Pete Part Three
    Participant

    >at least we have those introductions to the series 8 scripts. Even if you don?t like VIII, the intros are interesting if I?m remembering properly.

    This is true. I hate 80% of that book (the scripts) and love the rest of it. I had a pretty valid reason for not buying it, until I read the introductions in a bookshop and realised I had to have it. But I’m a sucker for that kind of thing, anyway. I don’t have any Doctor Who DVDs (Sky plussed all the good episodes) but I bought The Writer’s Tale, and didn’t hesitate purchasing it all over again the other day (with the new bits) simply because it was so bloody good. Also found The Nth Doctor fascinating.

    #108237
    Danny Stephenson
    Keymaster

    It would be nice to have the rest of the series’ as those kind of Script books. I know we have the Son of Soup and what not, but something to the quality of that RDVIII Book would be lovely.

    #108238
    p2p_productions
    Participant

    I’d still love to see a Series IX book happen in some shape or form. Imagine a ‘making of’ concerning a series that never happened… :) Could be great.

    My main issue with The Donner Cut is that, in a weird kind of way, it isn’t really The Donner Cut, or even an Assembly Cut for that matter. If anything, it’s more of a remastered Superman II, with a couple of deleted scenes/screen tests shoehorned in between stuff that actually works.

    I actually prefer a lot of the reshoot material in ‘II’. It just feels better, IMO. I like that Superman’s biological mother plays as much of a role in his life that his father did in the first film. I like that when Superman gives up his powers because he loves Lois, he softly asks for permission and guidance rather than getting tetchy and defensive with Brando. I like that Zod and his cronies are portrayed as more ludicrously fun than ludicrously sinister. I like the magic kiss over turning back time/hitting the reset button.

    The Lester Cut just works so much better for me – at least it’s complete, I guess. An even better version was on Youtube a while back, called The Selutron Cut. Sadly, the account later closed, but while it was there, the work was just phenomenal. For me, it had just the right balance of Donner to Lester, pleasing both crowds by presenting the best movie possible, rather than just a single directorial vision.

    #108241
    Andrew
    Participant

    > The Selutron Cut. Sadly, the account later closed, but while it was there, the work was just phenomenal.

    A few clips here:

    http://www.capedwonder.com/newwebsite/pages/selutron.html

    #108243
    p2p_productions
    Participant

    Cheers Andrew, haven’t seen these clips for ages! CapedWonder’s a great site too. If memory serves, a colourised B&W Chris Reeve photo I worked on might still be floating around one of the galleries…

    #108244
    pfm
    Participant

    I truly hope the definitive Superman 1 & 2 DOES happen at some point. All these years we’ve been denied the real masterpiece that, as Selutron shows, IS possible to achieve with some effort.

    #108246
    Andrew
    Participant

    I’m not impressed with “Selutron” – just read an interview and his attitude…not great. It’s possible to do this kind of job without being contemptuous of – and rude about – those who went before. (Not least by acknowledging the production issues that don’t encumber fan projects.) The tinkering’s interesting, but it’s not a ground-up overhaul; I don’t see ‘phenomenal’ at all.

    Mind you, I’m not convinced all this tinkering could provide anything remotely definitive, either. The definitive version of the two-part saga was never shot, never even fully written, so how can it be cobbled together? We’ve not been denied something. Putting Zod in front of the White House is interesting, but it doesn’t suddenly make the whole thing work. What ending do you put on film one to get a ‘definitive’ version?

    It’s becoming Koch’s Snowflake at this point – infinite variations trapped within a finite, flawed total area.

    #108248

    Which interview is that? Could you post a link to it, please?

    #108252
    pfm
    Participant

    > I?m not impressed with ?Selutron?

    I don’t think his particular version would be the best either, and if he thinks the studio would involve him if or when they get round to re-editting the films he can think again. No, there can never be the definitive vision as Donner wanted, but there IS room for an overhaul resulting in an interesting 2-part experiment, but I suppose that’s all it ever could be. They’d need to spend a few million to achieve anything more and that ain’t gonna happen.

    > It?s becoming Koch?s Snowflake at this point – infinite variations trapped within a finite, flawed total area.

    You – said – Koch. Where the hell did this come from, Ellard? No doubt you devise new variations in your spare time…

    #108253
    p2p_productions
    Participant

    >The tinkering?s interesting, but it?s not a ground-up overhaul; I don?t see ?phenomenal? at all.

    ‘Phenomenal’ as in, for a fan edit – workload must’ve been intense. Admittedly, a completely rejigged/remastered official version spanning both films would be more than difficult, but yeah, I’m sure some kind of special/anniversary edition is possible, down the line. Maybe not The Definitive Take, but at the very least, something fun for the fans. :)

    #108261
    Andrew
    Participant

    > Which interview is that? Could you post a link to it, please?

    http://www.supermanhomepage.com/movies/movies.php?topic=interview-selutron

    > Where the hell did this come from, Ellard? No doubt you devise new variations in your spare time?

    Um…huh?

    #108279

    http://www.supermanhomepage.com/movies/movies.php?topic=interview-selutr…”

    Yeah, he does come across as being a bit up himself, and being very down Michael Thau.

    I bet he’s doing it for himself, really.

    #108307
    pfm
    Participant

    > Um?huh?

    New variations of the Snowflake, I mean.

    #108317
    Andrew
    Participant

    > New variations of the Snowflake, I mean.

    Still don’t get it…

    #108323
    Dave
    Participant

    > New variations of the Snowflake, I mean.

    I made a snowman and then I didn’t send a photo of it to a news organisation of any kind.

    Does that count?

    #108328
    pfm
    Participant

    > Still don?t get it?

    There’s a snake in mah boots!!

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