Extra Final Scene!

[Pete Part Three]

The ending of Psirens has always jarred with me a little. I’m not a huge fan of the episode but the final lines are all a bit serious for my liking; bigging up the adventurous aspects of the rest of the series, rather than the comedy:

RIMMER: Approaching nebula.
LISTER: Let’s see what’s in there.

Here’s my proposal for an Extra Final Scene!

TEMPTRESS : So, are those guys coming to rescue us or not?
TEMPTRESS 2: I don’t think so. Oh well, we shall just have to pleasure ourselves in their absence.

(Episode to end about 15 minutes later)

You see, the temptresses weren’t really Psirens they were just helpless nymphomaniac damsels in distress. Your expectations were confounded and from thence the humour arose. Do you see?

Anyone got any other “improvements” for Red Dwarf?

Topic

[Andrew]

Actually, that’s pretty good…

[Ian Symes]

If only you used the stage direction “and then they lez up”, that would have been perfect.

[Zombie Jim Undead]

Can it include greased fisting?

[Pete Part Three]

>If only you used the stage direction ?and then they lez up?, that would have been perfect.

Bah. A missed opportunity if ever there was one.

[Dave]

>A missed opportunity if ever there was one

Barely three thousand of them

[ChrisM]

That would have been amusing.

Actually it’s a variant on a scene I saw in a Carry on movie once. (I believe it was Carry-on follow that camel).

There you had a bunch of guys traveling through the desert and they are fooled by a couple of mirages. They then find a diner in the desert, take one look, “I’m not fooling for that one again” then wander off.

Then a couple of chaps come out and one of them says ” I knew we shouldn’t have set up business out here, no one will come.” Something to that effect anyway.

Of course the Dwarfy version above, is a lot more saucy.

Incidentally, talking about carry-on films, I saw a bit from Carry-on England the other day, and it was more saucy than other carry-ons I’ve seen. I.e. they don’t usually go further than showing ladies in skimpy outfits. Apart from the famous Barbara Windsor catapulting bikini top of course, but even that was only on screen for a couple of seconds.

In this one they showed a whole bunch of topless army girls all standing in a row, plumpies totally on display for a couple of minutes. Apparently the commander (sergeant-major I believe) had told them on the tanoy, “You are to wear your uniform trousers. That is all.” (as in that’s all I have to say.) Saucy minxes decided to interpret him differently. I wonder if they decided to tone it down a bit in later shows for a more mainstream audience.

[John Hoare]

I wonder if they decided to tone it down a bit in later shows for a more mainstream audience.

Quite the reverse. Carry On England was the second-to-last Carry On of the classic series (forgetting Columbus and London) – only Carry On Emmannuelle came after it. And those last two films were deliberately designed to be raunchier, to compete with the Confessions series, and the other more explicit British sex comedies. (And failed miserably. England is fucking awful. And I say that as a fan of the Carry Ons. And as a fan of the Confessions films, come to that.)

Out of interest, some of the 70s British sex comedies had extra hardcore inserts – sometimes featuring the main cast, sometimes with a completely different one – which were included when the films were sold abroad. Not the Carry Ons though, obviously!

[Jonathan Capps]

FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE-DOM!

[John Hoare]

Out of interest, some of the 70s British sex comedies had extra hardcore inserts

http://www.bgafd.co.uk/miscellany/british-sc70s.php

[ChrisM]

Heh, shows how much I know about the Carry-ons. I had an idea it was earlier for some reason. I think the date was 1976… which I suppose in hindsight is about right… although I mentally considered that ‘early’… probably cos I was 1 years old when it came out. Yes I know, no real logic there.

As for the raunchier sex comedies, I seem to remember having seen parts of a film with a handy man having his way with a bunch of ladies… The tone was very carry-onish but with full on rumpy pumpy including a rather famous soapy kitchen scene. That’s one way to scoot across the floor I suppose…

[Steve Harris]

That sounds familiar and could well be from a confessions film…

Actually, is this a good time to mention that many years ago the stage version of window cleaner came to Hereford…
I’m sure most of the audience assumed it would be a tamed down version (sleepy little market town in the middle of nowhere etc), how wrong they were…
I went with two mates and my mates aunty who worked with us, bizarre evening..
It took me some time to get the image of Robin Askwiths knob and Aunt betty’s squeals of delight out of my mind…

[Andrew]

John would like an in-depth review for NtS. Whenever you’re ready.

:-)

[Steve Harris]

Oddly enough, just went to the theatre site to see if I could put a date on the confessions show and ended up buying tickets for Norman and Hattie…

And there’s no history section anyway, mind you, the theatre has been knocked down and re-built/re-named since…

[pfm]

It only ends like that as a sort of parody of TNG. Although not all episodes have to end on a comedic note. They were probably just testing that out. Gunmen and Out Of Time both end in a non-jokey way

[John Hoare]

Yes, the soapy kitchen scene is from Confessions of a Window Cleaner. Which I saw recently, and is a lot of fun. (And I found it genuinely sexy, notwithstanding Askwith’s bottom.)

And the stage show version sounds fascinating, Steve! I’d never heard of it. I suspect it was never recorded, which is a huge shame…

[Andrew]

> Gunmen and Out Of Time both end in a non-jokey way

There are great reams of stuff to be written about the endings to Red Dwarf episodes; it often seems that Rob and Doug struggled for final gags despite 28 minutes of prior genius.

So many eps have re-done or not-as-planned endings (Justice’s added scene, Dimension Jump’s cut kippers, Rimmerworld’s missing Lister gag), a lot rely on on something whimsical rather than outright funny (Gunmen’s cowboy ref, Justice again), there are some odd codas (Legion, Justice AGAIN) and then there are the cliffhangers (OOT)…

One of my favourite endings occurs in one of my absolutely least-favourite episodes, Nanarchy. While it was treated as a cliffhanger, I never saw it as one (Kryten ends DNA as human, doesn’t make it a cliffhanger; sitcoms press the reset button all the time anyway, so a big Lister and Red Dwarf is no big deal). But it does use proper, smart structure to pull off a neat visual gag. The nanos make Lister bigger…and as soon as we realise Red Dwarf’s huge too, we understand why. Nobody has to say “Hey, they did to the ship what they did to Lister, using generous scale as a sort of apology after all the trouble they’ve caused.”

[Zombie Jim Undead]

Shame the effect of muscular Lister is so bad.

[Pete Part Three]

I don’t think it’s THAT bad. It looks pretty awful when he screams though. And, like Andrew, I rather like the “Guys, I think we’ve got a problem” ending, even if they did have to re-do it (Back to the Future Part II style) for the opening of Series VIII.

The Justice ending has never really worked for me. Back to Reality is similarly whimsical.

[Zombie Jim Undead]

> It looks pretty awful when he screams though.

That was the bit I meant.

I do rather like the punchline of the Inquisitor. I always find the endings of Polymorph 2 and Quarantine buttock-clenchingly naff, though.

[Andrew]

Series III (ever my favourite) has possibly the best hit-rate for endings, now I think about it – Marooned’s is spot-on and Polymorph’s is a teriffic rug-puller. Backwards’ is a slightly forced coda, but it’s executed awfully well, and Bodyswap’s capper is spot-on sit-com fare.

The Last Day’s final scene always seems somehow ill-fitting to me, but at least the conclusion comes from previously-established information. It’s only Timeslides that’s both awkwardly added-on AND clumsily executed.

Okay, who wants to break down the other series…? :-)

[Pete Part Three]

Timeslides ending is OK. It doesn’t make ANY sense, but it still amuses me. The apathy which Lister, Cat and Kryten show to Rimmer blowing up is pretty funny.

I have more problems with the beginning with Lister acting out of character.

[John Hoare]

Timeslides is very odd, but it works for me because of the apathy, as Pete says – and I like a nice “What the FUCK?” ending occasionally. There is NO way Lister would act like that, though. Cat, yes – Lister, no. (If you’re allowing some leeway, they probably still think Rimmer’s a hologram, and can’t be harmed. But Lister would still go and investigate A BIG FUCK-OFF EXPLOSION.)

I’ve always liked the one for Justice, though. The lack of audience laughter makes it feel odd, but it works if only for the splash, and all it signifies, which is nicely timed.

I love Quarantine‘s as well. But I must admit that whilst I never used to mind it, Emohawk‘s irritates me a bit now.

[Phil]

>Emohawk?s irritates me a bit now.

What a Hoare!

[Seb Patrick]

>Okay, who wants to break down the other series?? :-)

I’m fairly sure series II nails it most of the time…

Kryten : is alright, the freeze-frame isn’t great, but it’s better than the “riding away” shot. In a story sense, it’s a good ending.

Better Than Life : that final scene feels a bit rushed, especially around Lister’s line, but the freeze frame and “GAME OVER” are great

Thanks for the Memory : the “let’s go and erase our memories” is a bit low-key (early example of not ending on a gag), but the jigsaw thing is utterly lovely.

Stasis Leak : “GO AWAAAAAY!!!!” That whole final scene is one of my favourite Dwarf moments ever.

Queeg : “Appreciate what you’ve got, because basically, I’m fantastic”. Come on, that’s a hell of a closing line.

Parallel Universe : “I’m going to be an uncle”. Great.

Yeah, I think II must have the best hitrate, unless anyone’s got anything better…

[ChrisM]

Emohawk is an interesting episode I think, in that it has some of my favourite season 6 moments, but there are some things that don’t quite work. I.e. the Kinitawowi (possibly misspelt) stuff is some of the funniest Dwarf I’ve seen. That little saucy wave one of the ‘bridesmaids’ gives Rimmer tickles me every time…

The stuff with Ace and Duane though… I’m kind of in two minds about that. Whilst I like the return of the characters, it felt a bit too…

(It’s difficult to think of the right terminology, but ‘a nod to long term fans whilst sacrificing the ‘reality’ of that world’ is what I mean. Physical appearance changes with the removal of their emotions… that sort of thing. I actually have a theory that accounts for how that might work, but it’s a bit of a stretch and the post is getting long as it is.)

It’s mainly just the introduction to those characters that affect me that way though. And it certainly didn’t stop me getting the special release of Beat the Geek with the Duane Dibley bobble head included. Ace willing to sacrifice himself and Duane was great (“Snap his head when he’s not looking.” Heh heh. I guess I have a warped mind).

I actually rather liked the ending though, it was a very twisty Dibley moment.

Not entirely sure why they’re mucking about with the freezing and the syringe when just the destruction of the polymorph in series 3 returned their emotions… but actually this makes a bit more sense than the original, kill-the-monster-and everything-returns-to-normal ending. More sci-fi, less fantasy.

[John Hoare]

Thanks for the Memory : the ?let?s go and erase our memories? is a bit low-key (early example of not ending on a gag), but the jigsaw thing is utterly lovely.

I used to HATE the ending of Thanks for the Memory, back in the days when I thought every single sitcom episode should end on a joke.

I still think that’s generally a good idea, but I’ve, erm, grown up a bit now, and I like the occasional more reflective ending. I still think “Let’s go and erase our memories” is a bit of an awkward line, though – I think just a simple “Come on” would have worked. It feels a bit over-explained.

[Andrew]

> Yeah, I think II must have the best hitrate

Interesting, too, how many of those come out the MOMENT the story is done. TFTM concludes literally as the last piece of the puzzle is put in, Kryten ends when the character goes, Holly’s revelation finishes Queeg…Yeah, you may be right.

The codas to BTL and Parallel Universe nicely come off the main content. it’s on Stasis Leak I don’t like – I think there’s a better joke to be done with Rimmer’s last line. But also, that scene turns into such chaos that, even with reset-button-sitcommyness, I really struggle to come back next week assuming it all got resolved somehow.

Sure, Lister’s decision has been made for him. But Cat really chooses to go back to a female-free existence? Rimmer really goes home and never tries again? Plus the leak is left open. It leaves the loose ends and gets stuck with a messy finale.

[Pete Part Three]

It was all a dream.

[Zombie Jim Undead]

The ending of every Black Books episode is annoying…with a forced “punchline” or sudden cut.

[John Hoare]

Stasis Leak: The Kenan and Kel of Red Dwarf.

[John Hoare]

Also: “At least I got to spunk in her.”

[Ridley]

“Mr. Darcy didn’t think Jane would enjoy French apples, but she did. Didn’t you, Jane?”

[Ian Symes]

The ending of every Black Books episode is annoying?with a forced ?punchline? or sudden cut.

– I ate all your bees!

– …

– You… FUCKER!

[Zombie Jim Undead]

Haha!

They should have kept it as the real ending.

[John Hoare]

Truth be told (and forgetting VII/VIII), the only endings I have a real problem with are Emohawk (and even then, I don’t mind it too much), and Dimension Jump. I thought the latter was dodgy from the very first time I watched it, and it’s in stark contrast to the brilliance of the rest of the episode. The Hammond stuff is great, but that kipper stuff is horribly awkward with the end of the scene cut off. (Although it would have been worse with it included!)

How did they EVER get to the edit suite with that ending? Why didn’t they do a reshoot? Did they just run out of time? (Dimension Jump was the second recorded in the series, so they would have had time… unless they were well behind on other things!) Frankly, they would have been better off cutting the scene entirely, and going from the Lister/Ace final scene, straight into the Rimmer Hammond stuff. You’ve still got the contrast between the two Rimmers with the juxtopositon of those two scenes. (Although I’ve never bought that liking Hammond organ music is particuarly sad. But then, I don’t buy the idea that being interested in telegraph poles is particuarly sad. It’s all funny stuff, and it works really well in context, but I’d rather spend my time with Rimmer than Lister, I think…)

Actually, is Rimmer’s “Take it away, skutters”, and the Hammond end theme, part of the original script – or were they added in post-production, to try and save the end of the episode? I know it’s in Primordial Soup as transmitted, but that means nothing – there’s loads of examples where the scripts have been altered from the original script to be what was actually transmitted, especially in that first book.

[Antipodean]

> “It?s difficult to think of the right terminology, but ?a nod to long term fans whilst sacrificing the ?reality? of that world? is what I mean.”

You mean “verisimilitude”?

[Dave]

>there?s loads of examples where the scripts have been altered from the original script to be what was actually transmitted, especially in that first book.

Really? It seems really odd that someone at Penguin or GNP would bother to do that. Revisionist history?

[John Hoare]

I keep meaning to write an article on it – in fact, I have a half-finished one round here somewhere. But especially in that first book, there’s loads of edits to match the transmitted episodes – which is even more obvious now the deleted scenes are available! (The second book does this less, with some first glimpses of certain deleted material. And the VIII scriptbook includes other deleted material – although still contains revisions, as the BITR script is presented in the transmitted three parts, rather than as a one-hour episode plus extra scenes shot to bulk it into three parts, as it was shot.)

I find it annoying, as the final shooting script with annotations describing the changes would be far more interesting than the edits. If you want the transmitted episode, go and watch the bloody thing!

Marooned, for instance, starts with the transmitted Holly voiceover, rather than the deleted poker scene.

[Dave]

That’s disappointing. I have the books but in all honesty I’ve never read them from cover to cover. As you say I’d go and watch the bloody thing.

Has anyone checked to see how close the original assembly is to the script in the Omnibus

[Andrew]

> Has anyone checked to see how close the original assembly is to the script in the Omnibus

Yes.

I’m just not telling. :-p

[Author]

Replies