Back to Earth running times

[Carlito]

I think it’s been established that the new episodes will each run to around 23 mins in length to accommodate adverts on the commercial channel of Dave.

However, I can’t understand why this is the case when the majority of Dave’s schedule (mined from the archives of the non-commercial BBC) usually takes up a 40 min block?

If there was a desperate need to fit into Dave’s usual evening schedule, I could see why, but most Dave shows were originally half hour shows, and extend to 40mins when ads are inserted upon conversion to the digital channel. Therefore, if anything, a half hour Red Dwarf (including ads) would actually be out of the norm and throw off the usual Dave schedule.

Plus being 30 mins in length never hurt the show on an international distribution level in the past, and surely there must be some other non-commercial channels in the world who usually show Dwarf and will now be faced with having to accommodate a 20-odd minute show into their schedules should they purchase the rights to show Back to Earth in the future.

Just seems odd, and even though I am aware that TOS has also noted a 23-min run time, I just wonder if that’s an oversight or mistake? It just seems more fitting for the show to be a 30 minute show, in a 40min block to house mid-way adverts. You know, like virtually every other show on the channel!

Topic

[Pete Part Three]

>I am aware that TOS has also noted a 23-min run time, I just wonder if that?s an oversight or mistake?

Doubtful.

[JamesTC]

Did the other Dave originals run at 23 minutes or 30 minutes. If anything it will be easier to sell to other countries at 23 minutes, no cuts to the episode or very few.

[si]

Have a look at Argumental, then come back. I haven’t time.

[Andrew]

> being 30 mins in length never hurt the show on an international distribution level in the past

How do you know?

I mean, yes, it’s shown a lot overseas – but how can you be sure the duration didn’t affect negotiations or available options? Not saying I know especially different…but, for the sake of argument, the show was edited drastically to fit the time-slot in Japan.

> I am aware that TOS has also noted a 23-min run time, I just wonder if that?s an oversight

Nope.

I totally get the “I wish these were longer, I want more” glutton approach to TV. If you like a thing, it’s hard to be sated. But this running time question is kinda like the American fans who can’t comprehend why we don’t have 22 episodes of the show every year.

Just my own take, but if you’re a commercial broadcaster who’s finally pushing to make their own shows, you’d be crazy to start with a policy of ‘go ahead, give us the same problems as our repeat archive’. The 40 minute slot is a pain, I’m sure. One commercial break in each show – compared to the ITV stations, that’s one less ad slot per hour with which to generate revenue. It’s not competitive.

The question isn’t “Why must their new shows be 23 minutes?” it’s “Aren’t we lucky they don’t hack their repeats down to fit a commercial 30 minute slot?”

[si]

The question isn?t ?Why must their new shows be 23 minutes?? it?s ?Aren?t we lucky they don?t hack their repeats down to fit a commercial 30 minute slot??

Good point, well made.

[Carlito]

No, I agree, but what I’m saying is when the MAJORITY of their shows run to 40mins, throwing a 30min show in there would be…. not “disruptive”, but it would alter their usual schedules. That’s all I’m saying.

[Andrew]

But their usual schedule is ‘accommodate the size of the existing show, whatever that is’. It’s not like it’s all 40 minute stuff, not if you have 50-minute OFAH or whatever. ‘Usual’ is a very variable term.

Plus, more importantly, you’re talking about a precedent-setting show. You don’t build a new, amazing thing from a starting point of ‘Let’s make this the same as the old stuff’. You do it in the way that’s appropriate to the new material to what you want to achieve with it.

[Carlito]

All I’m saying is that with Dave’s schedules pretty much all over the place (and yes I am aware that not EVERY show on Dave is originally a half hour show, which is why I used words to the effect of “a lot of” or “most”) then it seems like they would be more flexible. So I guess it beggars the question: was the 23-min-plus-ads runtime a Dave decision or a GNP decision?

[Carlito]

I mean, if it was a GNP decision, then it could just be due to the flow and structure of the story and not wanting to overstretch it, which would be fair enough. If it was a Dave decision then I’m sure it would be more motivated by scheduling, which makes it a bit of a curious one considering their current layout, but again would be fair enough if that’s what they wanted.

[si]

How long is the Making Of show?

[Phil]

35 minutes.

[locusceruleus]

I guess since the first showings of Back To Earth are surrounded by other Dwarf goodies, affecting regular scheduling isn’t an issue. We also know the first repeats will be shown on a single night too.

[pfm]

What we’re getting basically amounts to a third of a normal Dwarf series (as opposed to the abnormal VII & VIII). This isn’t something we should be whining about. End.

[Dave]

>What we?re getting basically amounts to a third of a normal Dwarf series (as opposed to the abnormal VII & VIII).

It’s also the same amount of footage as back when we thought we were getting two episodes and an unplugged, but probably assumed the running times to be the same as the previous 52 eps.

Remember when we were happy with that?

>This isn?t something we should be whining about. End.

Agreed.

[locusceruleus]

So is it pretty much confirmed that the DVD will contain the episodes as-broadcast, and not extended as BobbyLlew suggested back when it was a two-parter?

Not complaining, just curious.

[Ian Symes]

So is it pretty much confirmed that the DVD will contain the episodes as-broadcast, and not extended as BobbyLlew suggested back when it was a two-parter?

No, nothing’s confirmed about the DVD other than the release date.

[locusceruleus]

True enough, though this is what leads me to believe the Xtended-for-DVD idea may have been dropped:

http://www.reddwarf.co.uk/news/2009/02/20/back-to-earth-the-trilogy/

“Doug Naylor had, as ever, written Back to Earth’s two-part story a little long – deliberately so, in fact, in preparation for a possible ‘Xtended cut’ on DVD.

Yet as the script evolved, it soon became clear that every scene in the show was necessary. There was no padding. And with later drafts maximising on ideas hinted at in the first versions, two 30-minute scripts (each already intended to be around 23 minutes, after editing, for broadcast on the a station that includes commercial breaks) slowly grew into a story that ran a total of around 70 minutes.”

[Nakrophile]

I wouldn’t be surprised if there is still some new stuff in the eps (on the DVD), just not as much of it as there would have been when it was a two-pater.

[Seb Patrick]

It?s also the same amount of footage as back when we thought we were getting two episodes and an unplugged, but probably assumed the running times to be the same as the previous 52 eps.

Remember when we were happy with that?

I never assumed that. My line of thinking was “It’s a channel with adverts. Oh, so the running time will be about 23-24 minutes, then.”

[Dave]

>I never assumed that. My line of thinking was ?It?s a channel with adverts. Oh, so the running time will be about 23-24 minutes, then.?

You are a wiser man than I.

[pfm]

I hope the DVD has a feature-length cut, maybe even with a couple more scenes in there that they couldn’t fit into the broadcast edits. Whatever, I’m sure we’re gonna get to see everything they’ve shot, even if it’s in the deleted scenes.

[ChrisM]

>I hope the DVD has a feature-length cut,

Considering how they treated the multi-part episodes in series 8, I suspect they will.

Not sure about the extra scenes. They’d be nice to see certainly, but if they were able to include everything they intended in the broadcast episodes, it’s probably best they don’t include other stuff just for the sake of it. I’m sure there’ll be the usual deleted scenes anyway.

[Carlito]

SO does it turn out that I was almost right?

[Author]

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