Doctor Who

[Smeg4Brains]

I’m surprised that this hasn’t already been mentioned but what did everybody think of Dr Who yesterday. Liked the introduction to Martha, wasn’t sure about the old woman using a straw to suck out the blood. I’ve got a feeling the Rhino things will come back at some point.

Topic

[Anonymous]

What I’m surprised at is the fact that nobody has mentioned that the Doctor appeared to say ‘smeg’ at one point during the episode.

[Anonymous]

I liked this, although I was rather frustrated that they seem to have left things open for a romantic relationship to blossom. If the Doctor and his companion revert to all the “wooohooo this is such a blast!” trappings of the Rose era, it’ll be really annoying.

But I thought this was a strong episode. A better introduction to a companion than the episode “Rose”, and not setting up Martha’s life on earth so much that they might need to keep taking us back to see how her family are missing her etc. Again: this is a great opportunity to dispense with the baggage from the Rose era, and I’ll be disappointed if they start laying the same pitfalls again with Martha. The episode started with her though, rather than the Doctor in the TARDIS (much as we had first meeting the new Doctor in “Rose”), which suggests Russell T Davies has an overriding concern with ensuring the series always takes the companion’s perspective, rather than that of the Doctor. Like it gives the young people something more human to relate to.

The structuring of this episode was pretty good too. From this and the christmas special it appears that we might have seen the end of the rushed magic-suddenly-solving-everything-within-the-final-two-minutes endings of the first two of the new series. Here’s hoping.

[Smeg4Brains]

> I was rather frustrated that they seem to have left things open for a romantic relationship to blossom.

I think it would spoil it if there was a romantic relationship between the Dr and Martha, it would ruin it if he fell in love with every companion he meets.

> this is a great opportunity to dispense with the baggage from the Rose era

Again I disagree, I liked the idea of Rose actually having a past and a life on present day Earth, rather than sodding off with the Doctor and not missing her past life.

[Seb Patrick]

Edited the subject heading – sorry, but I can’t bear to see it written as “Dr Who” ;-)

Anyway, this was ace. Loved the tie bit, loved Zovirax, loved Anne Reid, loved the new improved Tennant performance, and most of all, loved Martha. Even my girlfriend, normally a mega Who-sceptic, thought it was a great ep because she liked Martha so much.

This series is going to kick considerable amounts of arse.

[Steve Harris]

I agree with Seb, apart from the ‘girlfriend’ bit as I dont know the lady, but the wife actually sat down and watched this one with us and stayed with it…

I felt that Martha, apart from oozing sex appeal also came across as more of an action girl type than Rose. Time will tell if She is going to be a great replacement but first signs are good. Looking very good so far. Loved the ‘Rhinos’, very military like.

Just one other point, loved the idea of the crosses but wouldn’t life have been so much simpler for an Alien to remain unoticed if they could have found a felt pen…

[John Hoare]

The comedy in this episode was the best it’s been in a long time. The Planet Zovirax gag, the fact that Emmeline Pankhurst nicked the Doctor’s laser spanner… excellent stuff.

At the risk of sounding predictable – it’s a far better comedy SF than fucking Hyperdrive. Of course, with every risk, there’s always the possibility of failure…

Also:

The logo of the Union Aerospace Corporation from Doom is seen on medical equipment in the MRI room.

Fantastic!

[Andrew]

> I think it would spoil it if there was a romantic relationship between the Dr and Martha, it would ruin it if he fell in love with every companion he meets.

Well, I’d say he loved Rose, rather than was IN love with her.

The implication in the interviews for this season seems to be that Martha’s romantic interest in the Doctor may be one-way-traffic. Which struck me as a pretty good iea. How could you NOT have a crush on the man?!

[Tarka Dal]

By being completly hetrosexual?

It was a great episode. A very swashbuckling, romp of a storyline which is a great way to watch any new season. As Andrew says above it looks like the ‘love’ is going to be unrequited. I wasn’t convinced by Martha in the trailers but seeing her in action (oooh pardon) she’s great. I love her inquisitive nature, how she seemed to take to concepts very quickly and then immediately want to know how and why etc. Having a whole new relationship at the centre of the show will help set this apart from it simply being Rose-era II.

I also don’t mind the on-earth bits. Again, I think it helps define this era of Who from the past. My only problem with them is scenes like the one with the 21st party play out like really bad soap opera. If you are going to flesh out the companion it’d be nice to have a more rounded family then a bunch of one-dimensional stereotypes.

At what point did he appear to say Smeg? I’ve watched the episode twice (almost) now and failed to spot that.

[Tarka Dal]

http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Hollow/5723/misc.html

Go to the the clip at the very bottom.

[Pete Part Three]

As a frequent detractor of the series, I was pleasantly surprised. This was far better than the last two openers, and a much better entry than the Christmas episode. Which was SHITE.

And Tennant rocks.

[Anonymous]

You gave me a dream last night because it was one where David Tennant kept saying “smeg” in a manic-paced sci-fi programme to a laughing audience.

[pfm]

> and a much better entry than the Christmas episode. Which was SHITE.

Well I thought that at first but after seeing it three times now (the third was on Sunday) I actually really like it. You’ve got to take it for what it is which is a fast-paced light-hearted jaunt for Christmas Day with remote controlled grenade baubles and everything (albeit with the slant that the Doctor is going through his own personal hell throughout). The Tardis motorway chase is top-notch, and Catherine Tate is great once she stops shouting every line (“OI! I’m LATE for the wedding! My OWN wedding! You’re GOING THe WRONG WAYY!!” etc.). She gets good when she starts fake-crying at the reception.

As for ‘Smith & Jones’ I think it’s the best episode Russell has written for Tennant so far, and it’s maybe even the best Tennant performance (although he was damn good in The Runaway Bride). A few things that were a gnat’s wing away from connecting throughout series 2 suddenly clicked together (with an audible CLICK!). Maybe it’s something to do with the FACT that Martha is already a much more suitable companion for David Tennant’s Doctor. It’s no good complaining about her family because what can you actually do in the two minutes of screentime they get? Her sister though is fucking lovely and I hope there’s a chance of her being more involved in later episodes (and maybe she could replace Martha as the companion if she is killed for some reason…). Freema seemed a little nervous in parts of the episode, but I reckon some of her lines were a bit clunky from the pen of Mr T Davies, especially at the end when she’s discovering the Tardis (despite Tennant mouthing ‘it’s bigger on the inside’ which is positively godlike). I don’t think they’ll ever beat Rose’s entry into the Tardis (‘it’s…alien’ ‘yes’ ‘you’re alien’ ‘yes, is that all right?’ ‘yeah’ or whatever it is, it’s crap written down but Billie and Eccleston pwn the world in the scene)

[Steve Harris]

It may seem like going against some Holy law but I was never a huge fan of Eccleston.
Some of his moments with Rose were sublime but all to often for me his rather odd smile ruined a scene. I cant really put my finger on it though it was verging on an almost nervous smile at times and I found this quite irritating. Rose was also a tad giggly throughout although on the whole I loved her.
I feel Tennant came in at the right time and took it to another level, first impressions suggest that Martha may have completed the picture.
Tennant was made for the role, he plays the eccentric side of the Doctor brilliantly, I just hope everyone can keep it up…Marvelous

[Andrew]

Thing is, Eccleston is one of my all-time favourite actors. Hearts and Minds, and his death in Cracker, are burned onto my brain forever.

BUT – with him as the Doctor, I always felt he was ‘acting eccentric and excited’ rather than…well, actually being it. Tennant’s enthusiasm and energy seems real, somehow. Natural. Just like Baker’s natural eccentricity.

It’s like…Dalton is a better ‘ac-tor’ than Connery. But there’s a natural suited-to-the-part vibe – especially visible on parts like Bond and The Doctor – that’s hard to compete with, no matter how good you are.

[Tarka Dal]

Eccleston however managed to take a very established role and create entirely his own persona with one-line. Tennant is really growing on me as the series continues but it’s taken long enough. In season 2 it to often felt like he was just a fanboy apeing Tom Baker era Who.

As for this…

> It?s no good complaining about her family because what can you actually do in the two minutes of screentime they get?

Well you can not have shit dialogue and a couple of completly unconvincing actors (The father and his blonde)

I do agree however that Martha is more suited to being Tennant’s companion. Rose seemed more suited to Eccleston. UK Gold showed ‘New Earth’ earlier and it got me thinking that the story suited Eccleston’s Doctor much more. Indeed thinking about it I could even see the Eccleston working well in Army of Ghosts/Doomsday. I’ve a feeling this season Tennant will easily surpass his last one.

Another way of looking at it is that in Season 2 he was the new kid on the block and Billie the old hand. Which doesn’t work so well when the story is meant to be about The Doctor and his companion (and not vice versa). As it is now The Doctor & actor are the wise old heads able to port wisdom onto the newcomer.

[pfm]

Well Eccleston still has my favourite moments of the series – the first scene with the Dalek, his speech to the Daleks at the end of Bad Wolf, his whole performance in The End Of The World (I watched it recently and fucking hell it’s gold), ‘everybody lives!’, the hologram moment. OK, a lot of this is to do with the better writing in series 1 and the perfect excellence of the Eccleston/Piper pairing, but you can’t deny how good he was in the role, and from the first instant.

[Flibster]

I noticed that too!!

[John Hoare]

In the latest SFX Collection Doctor Who special, there’s the results of a favourite episode poll. Out of the last two series, The Girl in the Fireplace won, which I can’t really argue with.

Lowest rated was Fear Her (fair comment, although I don’t hate it as much as most people seem to), and second lowest was The Long Game. Third lowest, however, was Love & Monsters, which I find utterly baffling. How can an episode that is basically a love letter to fandom – at 7:00pm on BBC ONE on a Saturday night, no less – be hated so much by a bunch of SF fans?

[Smeg4Brains]

I really can’t stand Love and Monsters…it was hardly even an episode of Dr Who. Maybe it could have worked as a spin-off set in the Dr Who world but the doctor was hardly in it. Just seemed like an excuse to use the Blue Peter competition winner and Peter Kay to me.

[Andrew]

Well, something had to be last – and second to last, and third to last – and frankly, Pegg or no Pegg, I’d have dumped The Long Game down to the bottom. Fear Her is redeemed for me by some of the smartest, most natural dialogue and gag writing of the series. (Fingers in the jar!)

> Just seemed like an excuse to use the Blue Peter competition winner and Peter Kay to me.

See, I never got that. When Davies’ recurring obsession is the effect the Doctor has on people – the ones he leaves behind, the ones he barely touches – Love & Monsters stands as the same theme, played on different instruments. Or something.

Whether you ENJOY his recurring obsession is something else…

Using Kay is no different from using Pegg, say; and a good monster idea is a good monster idea, wherever it comes from. What’s ‘Dalek’ if not an exploitation of a good monster?

[Ben Kirkham]

Love and Monsters was carrying on a long Doctor Who tradition to try something different. I loved it.

As for Smith and Jones, I loved that too. I was worried about the new series after Army of Ghosts. I thought it seemed as though it had let the effects and spectacle take over a bit. The Runaway Bride was fun but disposable.

Martha seems like a much better companion than Rose. I liked Rose, but Martha is much more switched on, very intelligent, sexy, and seems to fit so well with the tenth Doctor. In fact, Martha reminded me of some of the best companions from the classic series but updated. Certain companions work better with some Doctors than others (like Adric and the fourth Doctor).

David Tennant was also absolutely terrific, his best performance yet. I’ve always loved him, but here he just seemed to nail everything so well. All of his humour and energy was perfectly in tune with the script.

The script itself was a clever little piece by Russell T Davies, and Martha’s family seem loaded with possibilities for storylines. Anyone who has followed the development of this current series will know that it is going to be brilliant.

A breath of wonderful fresh air, frankly.

[John Hoare]

The Long Game is one of the weaker episodes… but I find it impossible to dislike too much – because when watching it I just have such good memories of the final two-parter. And it’s an extremely traditional Who story as well, which is nice to have.

Love & Monsters really is one of my favourite episodes of new Who, though. The whole fandom thing just resonates a lot with me.

[pfm]

You see, I think the fandom element is what put some people off the episode. Some people (stupidly) thought he was having a go at fandom. Perhaps the whole thing was too self-aware, it was more like an episode about Doctor Who rather than an episode OF Doctor Who. I think everyone was anticipating it as the stupid Doctor-liteAbsorbaloff/Peter Kay episode too, which didn’t help. I liked it though, particularly the parts with Jackie where she wasn’t annoying for once, and the whole sort of life-affirming message of it all.

The worst episode is definitely Fear Her, but I also had problems with New Earth, the series 2 finale 2-parter, The Long Game, The Idiot’s Lantern and parts of School Reunion (the Sarah Jane stuff is OK (even though Tennant hadn’t nailed his Doctor by then and went overboard) but the rest…probably more suitable for the upcoming Sarah Jane spinoff).

[Tarka Dal]

I’ve only see Love & Monsters once but I didn’t enjoy it at all. I can appreciate the ‘fandom’ angle and on paper I find it an intriguing one. Expect that my life is fandom, therefore I don’t need it in the show I’m a fan off.

My problem with it was I when tune in to watch Doctor Who I expect a few things. I expect the Tardis, maybe a companion or two and most of all I expect The Doctor. Instead it all felt very redundant, 40 minutes investing in characters which were never to be seen again. It wasn’t all bad, Mark Warren is likeable and the music was great but over all 90% of it was a bunch of pretty dull characters faffing about and Peter Kay hamming it up as the honey monster from the planet zog. Then at the end, The Doctor turns up, you get a two minute tease of what you actuall tuned in for and *bam* over. That’s meant to be your Who fix for another seven days. Well sorry but bugger that.

Perhaps if Who had seasons similar in length to american shows, 20+ episodes, and L&M was just one episode out of a hundred It wouldn’t irk me so much. As it stands we get thirteen episodes and I want to see The Doctor or his companion at the heart of all of them. If budget & time can’t manage this, then cut the bloody series to twelve episodes please.

Oh and School Reunion was bloody great, it had that for kids and big kids feel about it, connected the new show up with Classic Who and managed to get Anthony Head in there as well. More like that please.

[John Hoare]

See, I think you’re allowed at least one episode a series (whether that series is six episodes long, 13 eps long, or 26 eps long) to be a complete format breaker, and have the balls to do something completely different. The thing is though, as Andrew says, and I mentioned in my review – I don’t think it’s much of a format-breaker at all. It might be in style, but not in content.

And just because something is part of my life, it doesn’t mean I don’t want to see it on-screen. Otherwise, I’d find very little I wanted to watch at all…

Weirdly though, I saw School Reunion again recently, and I stand by my original assesment of it at the time – which was, it’s just not as clever as it thinks it is. Old companion coming back is a great idea – but they didn’t do nearly enough with it. The stuff about companions dying and The Doctor living on was fine – but the forced rivalry between Sarah Jane and Rose is APPALLING, and I found embarassing to watch. Cumulating in that Loch Ness Monster argument that makes me want to tear my face off. Absolutely diabolical dialogue, which unfortunately New Who badly suffers from at times. (See also: “I think you need a Doctor…”)

Which is a shame, because everyone always talks about how great the episode is – and I’d hoped that I’d finally see what people raved about it so much for. But no such luck, sadly.

[Tarka Dal]

I agree you are allowed format breakers, I love them – It wasn’t that which frustrated more the complete lack of Who & Companion replaced by characters that all seemed a bit watery. Likewise I’m not saying that because something is in your life it you can’t watch shows about it. Simply that in terms of sci-fi fandom, I personally don’t feel the need too.

I wouldn’t even go as far at to say L&M was a bad episode, just one that I didn’t like. For example Fear Her I thought could have been reasonably watchable but in the second half the production and script totally fell apart and it made my skincrawl.

[mick]

The only post I bothered reading here was Ben’s, this was because he has Paul McGann as his avatar and is from Stoke, thus he is vastly superior to you all.

[Smeg4Brains]

>The only post I bothered reading here was Ben?s, this was because he has Paul McGann as his avatar and is from Stoke, thus he is vastly superior to you all.

But I have a potato in a fish bowl……anyone?…

[Ben Kirkham]

> “The only post I bothered reading here was Ben?s, this was because he has Paul McGann as his avatar and is from Stoke, thus he is vastly superior to you all.”

Well, *blushes*, thank you. But substitute ‘superior’ for anally retentive Doctor Who fan!

As for McGann, his avatar works best and he is a brilliant, brilliant Doctor. Especially in the audios.

> “But I have a potato in a fish bowl??anyone??”

I love potatoes and fish bowls!

[pfm]

> (See also: ?I think you need a Doctor??)

I laughed so much at that when it was first on. I don’t think it’s a bad line though. In any other episode it would have been but right at that point at the end of series 1 it’s needed. The line makes it feel like a euphoric, climactic moment.

[Anonymous]

Yeah but Smeg4Brains, it’s unclear whether your potato can’t swim because it’s a potato or because there’s no water in the bowl.

[Ben Kirkham]

> (See also: ?I think you need a Doctor??)

I thought it was cheesy but thank God for Christopher Eccleston (the unwilling), who delivered it in the best possible way he could. I bet he nearly keeled over when he read that one…

[Smeg4Brains]

> Edited the subject heading – sorry, but I can?t bear to see it written as ?Dr Who? ;-)

I get the same sort of thing when people refer to the Doctor as ‘Doctor Who’…..THATS NOT HIS NAME DAMMIT!

[John Hoare]

Just going back to Love & Monsters a minute – this review is just brilliant.

[Ben Kirkham]

A brilliant review that just *nails* everything about the episode.

[Tarka Dal]

Unless you happen to disagree of course.

[pfm]

> THATS NOT HIS NAME DAMMIT!

Tell that to the show credits.

[Ian Symes]

He’s credited as “The Doctor”, you big twat.

[Andrew]

> He?s credited as ?The Doctor?, you big twat.

He is now – but Eccleston’s wasn’t…

[pfm]

> He is now – but Eccleston?s wasn?t?

See. However, I’ll own up I thought it still said ‘Doctor Who’. That’s because I don’t look at the credits through immediately switching to Confidential (and frankly the end theme just pisses me off with it’s bombastic nature). Anyway, it said ‘Doctor Who’ in classic episodes.

[Ben Kirkham]

> Anyway, it said ?Doctor Who? in classic episodes.

Hartnell to Tom Baker were ‘Doctor Who’ and Davison to McCoy (and McGann in the TV Movie, I think) were ‘The Doctor.’

[Smeg4Brains]

> Hartnell to Tom Baker were ?Doctor Who? and Davison to McCoy (and McGann in the TV Movie, I think) were ?The Doctor.?

You’re just like a bucket full of Doctor Who knowledge aren’t you? You like a bucket of Whoness…..a Who bucket……a Whoket, if you will.

[Ian Symes]

> Hartnell to Tom Baker were ?Doctor Who? and Davison to McCoy (and McGann in the TV Movie, I think) were ?The Doctor.?

To cloud matters further, Davidson is credited as Doctor Who just the once – at the end of Logopolis.

[Ben Kirkham]

A Whoket, I love that!

Un/fortunately, I don’t have an encyclopaedic knowledge of Red Dwarf… yet.

[pfm]

“I – am – a – hu – man – Da – lek – with – a – lame – A – mer – i – can – ac – cent – and – shi -tty – an – i – ma – tron – ic – ten – ta – cles!”

[Tarka Dal]

Yeah funny that. An american having a lame american accent.

[pfm]

I mean it’s lame that it has an American accent (because, let’s face it, American’s suck). It should be Sec’s voice but more humanized.

[Anonymous]

Can anyone shed light for me as to how that human dalek is scarier than a normal dalek? Okay, so it has space for human thinking, but surely that’s been proven at other times to be a weakening point whenever a dalek has been contaminated? Also: 1) A human dalek can’t glide around, hover, shoot things etc; 2) A human dalek doesn’t have a bullet-proof dalek casing; 3) It looked hilarious rather than scary. It’s like a boglin or ALF soft toy – an ugly but ‘misunderstood’ monster with a heart, so you have to love it really.

[Andrew]

> Can anyone shed light for me as to how that human dalek is scarier than a normal dalek?

It’s not. Hope that sheds some light. :-)

It also takes the species back to its old, human-ish form, and misses the whole point of Dalek’s natural, built-in lack of compromise. Ho-hum.

[Seb Patrick]

It should be Sec?s voice but more humanized.

No it shouldn’t, it has the human bloke’s mouth and vocal chords. So it has his voice, but with Sec’s intonation. You may think it sounds silly, but that’s how it should be.

In fact, there’s a part of me that’s wondering if the human Dalek is SUPPOSED to be completely shit and inferior. I get the feeling that Sec’s going to realise he’s made a massive mistake coming out of his comfy indestructible shell, and that the other three are also going to see him as weaker and attempt to off him…

[Author]

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