Let’s Talk About Twentica (on UKTV Play)

Yes, it seems like despite having waited for nearly four years for a new episode of Red Dwarf to come along, the big day has crept right up to our astonished faces. A week ahead of Twentica‘s debut on Dave, it’s going to be released online “by this afternoon”. We don’t know when exactly, but we’ll update this post with a link when we spot it. In the meantime, make sure you’re registered and signed in on UKTV Play, to avoid delays.

EDIT: IT’S ONLINE. IT’S BLOODY HERE. BLOODY HELL.

Of course, the above only applies to those of you who aren’t saving yourself for the TV broadcast this time next week. From this point on, things get a little bit confusing. We’re doing our best to cater for all fans over the next seven weeks, so all posts will be clearly marked with a big friendly banner, as you can see above, telling you whether or not it’s safe to read. Our spoiler policy has been updated, and it’s more important than ever that you acquaint yourself with it.

Put simply: before it’s broadcast on telly, you can only discuss Twentica on threads with the blue UKTV Play banner. If you see a Dave banner, or no banner at all, don’t discuss the episode there. We’ll keep the extracts on the home page spoiler free, but if you’re waiting for the Dave broadcasts, don’t click on posts with the blue UKTV Play banner, and don’t read comments on those posts. You’ll see a nice “you can read this” Dave banner on posts starting next week.

It’s still a bit annoying that the audience is split up in this way, but at the very least, we’ll be making it as easy as possible for people to catch up with any episode-based content they’ve missed, with new navigation options waiting to be unveiled as soon as they’re necessary. In the meantime, those of you who can’t resist watching the episode online can discuss it on this post right now, and look out for a brand new feature either later tonight or early tomorrow (depending on when the episode is live), running you through the biggest talking points that Twentica turns up.

Good luck, everybody. Here it comes…

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221 Responses to Let’s Talk About Twentica (on UKTV Play)

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  1. G&T Admin

    Wow. That autoplay when you land on the UKTV Play site is REALLY annoying (geddit?).

  2. >Wow. That autoplay when you land on the UKTV Play site is REALLY annoying (geddit?).

    Yesterday all your troubles seemed so far away.

  3. OH GOD OH GOD OH GOD. Well, my work deadline today is clearly going to slip quite considerably.

  4. As someone who didn’t have Sky HD when RDX was on, I have never seen an episode of RD in HD. I am so tempted to watch this now at my desk in work, but I also want to see it in HD next week and experience that picture quality upgrade.

    Decisions, decisions…! (I’ll most likely be waiting until next Thursday night…)

  5. (no spoilers)

    Aaaaaaaaaaaaah I really enjoyed that!

    Did it hit the mark with absolutely every joke? Not at all, and there’s one joke in particular involving a popular confectionery snack that made me groan, but it felt so rich with plot and actual content that the occasional joke falling flat didn’t bother me.

    Honestly, I enjoyed series 10 but this feels like a huge step up in quality. I can definitely see where the series 5-6 comparisons have come from from the studio recordings… this felt very much of that era, though also very fresh.

    Can’t wait for more!!

  6. Did Doug knock it out the park? he come fairly close, there were one or two jokes i thought got abit corny like with the villains at the end and the talk of cliche that i could have lived without but it was decent i thought, although i did only wake up like an hour ago and watched it straight away so i am still fairly fatigued

    Impressive looking series though. sense of adventure seems to be back which is good

  7. The guest starring in Red Dwarf hobby is a good hobby for all hobbyists.

  8. G&T Admin

    I heard he was paid in green jelly.

  9. (Not reading any of the above)

    It seems the episode is available on Sky’s on demand section to download in HD!

    I know what I’ll be watching tonight…!

  10. The ending was very flat (but I find that to be the case alarmingly frequently throughout RD in general), but there were some solid jokes that made me laugh out loud for real.
    The speakeasy comparison of prostitution to science allowed for some great gags, although my personal favourite was Kryten’s own description of what happened to his face.
    Also, as Den of Geek say in their review, there’s never an explanation of the episode title, which is odd.
    Overall, I am super pleased by this solid return to form.

  11. Yes I enjoyed that. I went in cautiously but it got me very quickly. Not all of the jokes tickled me, but the (very) few that didn’t – well, they didn’t have me shaking my head or tutting or anything.

    It’s new Dwarf so I don’t trust my opinion completely yet, but as of this moment I’m willing to say I enjoyed it more than any episode of X.

    Nice to see Pree again, albeit not as Pree.

  12. I’ve just watched it and will not be discussing it until the instant reaction Dwarfcast kicks off after the Dave broadcast next week.

    But the logo flies in from the sides, just like mama used to make. That’s all I wanted and I got it.

  13. Very much enjoyed that, yes it was quick paced but it was brilliant. Funny, sci-fi relevant and not a dull moment. Guest cast were also brilliant! Very much looking forward to the rest of the series, its everything i wanted it to be. the America set was brilliant!!

  14. Really is great casting all round. Particularly nice to see Rebecca Blackstone back in a cameo. Lucie Pohl is superb. Kevin Eldon is everything you’d expect from an appearance from him in Red Dwarf and more.

    I rather liked the scene back on Red Dwarf at the end. Unlike the similar ending scene from Justice, this was actually funny. I can see why people are saying the ending is a little rushed but the episode as a whole zips by at a whopping pace.

    So many classic moments it is hard to pick out on particular favourite. The first that comes to mind is the look on Lister’s face when he drinks from the flask and the “How dense do you think I am” joke. That whole bar scene is probably the best single scene in Red Dwarf since 1993.

  15. The villains were abit of a disapointment by the end, doug humanised them into being funny and i think at that point they stop feeling like a threat and just become poor villians which is sad because when it comes to bad guys in the early days they were taken much more seriously.

  16. I really enjoyed that. I still feel like the editing and direction is missing a bit of something, but I had a smile on my face for the whole thing.

    Time to go and re-read the filming reports having seen the finished product I reckon.

    That said…

    WHERE THE SMEG WAS THE FLYING OVER RED DWARF CREDITS SHOT?!

    edit: I un-ironically want to spend time in that bar.

  17. Yes, what the fuck was going on regarding the lack of an end credit flyover?

    I’m guessing Doug just doesn’t like it anymore as they certainly have the motion control rig and detail available on the model to pull it off.

  18. Overall a solid episode, I laughed whilst watching it but didn’t feel there were any absolutely huge woofs in there. 3 star episode.

    I always have a mixed reaction to episodes where the Dwarfers end up on some form of parallel Earth or go back in time. The more they do it the more it begs the question of why Lister wouldn’t just stay there, rather than choose to go back to being marooned in deep space. I liked that they at least gave a story-specific reason for it this time, but the more the show goes back to this particular well the more strained it seems.

    Also only dawned on me afterwards that there is no explanation of the title at all.

  19. Overall a solid episode, I laughed whilst watching it but didn’t feel there were any absolutely huge woofs in there. 3 star episode.

    I always have a mixed reaction to episodes where the Dwarfers end up on some form of parallel Earth or go back in time. The more they do it the more it begs the question of why Lister wouldn’t just stay there, rather than choose to go back to being marooned in deep space. I liked that they at least gave a story-specific reason for it this time, but the more the show goes back to this particular well the more strained it seems.
    Also only dawned on me afterwards that there is no explanation of the title at all.

    Just before coming back to the thread that occurred to me as well. They have access to another device that apparently lets you go anywhere in time and space, but choose to go back to the far lonely future?

  20. My first thought was being amazed at how close the mock-up title sequence in the other thread was to the real thing.
    For me, the first half was a little flat – not terrible, but a lot of the jokes made me smile rather than laugh, which had me a little worried. But then the second half more than made up for it, crammed with excellent lines and lots of belly laughs.
    In terms of plot, action and overall feel I thought it was excellent, a definite step up from X, and it looked great. I was a bit worried about the whole concept after reading the synopsis, but it all hung together brilliantly, including the reasoning behind going back to the ship (a lovely return to the Lister/Kryten friendship of the early ’90s). The only criticism I’d have of the synopsis is that I wasn’t able to enjoy the reveal of the plot. Funny as the toaster scene was, I know I’d have found it much more amusing if I had no idea what was going on. So I’m going to try my hardest not to read anything else about forthcoming episodes in the hope that I forget what they’re about…

    Really happy to see The Actor Kevin Eldon in Red Dwarf. He was as fantastic as could be expected.

    I’m going to have to give it another couple of views to be able to rate it I think, but from the first watch I’d say I found it as good as the best stuff from X, but not quite a classic.

  21. While it isn’t explained in the episode, I thought it was clear why the episode was called this?

  22. I never thought I’d say this, but that episode would have been better if they for some reason had Talkie Toaster with them.

  23. Also…. don’t slay me for this (as I believe this, er, may have been briefly mentioned recently) but I really dislike how Kryten looks. I’m sure it’s a personal taste thing but, to me, he LOOKED like Kryten in Back to Earth and since then he’s looked like an attempted cosplay of Kryten that hasn’t quite got the angular features right.

    Not going to be a negative for the series or anything but I had that reaction to him every time he was on screen (though he looked better in the era costume).

  24. Also…. don’t slay me for this (as I believe this, er, may have been briefly mentioned recently) but I really dislike how Kryten looks. I’m sure it’s a personal taste thing but, to me, he LOOKED like Kryten in Back to Earth and since then he’s looked like an attempted cosplay of Kryten.

    Not going to be a negative for the series or anything but I had that reaction to him every time he was on screen (though he looked better in the era costume).

    He is 100% not the same mechanoid that we saw in previous series.

    Doesn’t bother me too much though, I just assume that Lister had to rebuild him again.

  25. His costume was rather… large. Otherwise it didn’t bother me. The mask was obviously different from previous series, but that’s pretty much a given anyway.

    That reminds me, I really enjoyed his walking up and down the cockpit. I would have enjoyed it more if I hadn’t been dreading some unnecessary joke pointing out how daft it looked, but it was just left to happen, which was a relief.

    Thinking back, I think what I wasn’t so fond of in the first half is how signposted some of the jokes were. They weren’t ridiculous enough to be Father Ted-esque – so obvious you expect it to be subverted, but it’s not – so the punchlines didn’t have much kick. It was done much better in the ‘any theories, Kryten?’ bit, because the exasperation of Rimmer’s ‘no!’ was unexpected and got a big laugh from me. I think these jokes just need that little something different or surprising, because otherwise they feel a bit like series 6 leftovers, 23 years later.

  26. Fantastic first episode. Love the more sciency episodes. Starbug and the lighting were fantastic. felt much more like a classic red dwarf episode :)

  27. Yeeeeee Haaaaaar Star-Buggys Malone!!!! Red Dwarf is back with an EMP big Bang!

    Singing “We could of been anything that we wanted to be, as long, as it was low tech! ”

    I loved that romp. A great choice to start the series with the adventure one, as we’ve got 4 or 5 more character ones coming up.

    What a crash! mix of CG and models yeah? Brilliantly done, amazing. This series has bits that make it look like the most amazing modern Dwarf ever, and loads and loads that make it feel like back in the day of III to VI. Only just a couple of bits that felt VIII or Dave era. I honestly dont remember claping at the audience recording, maybe I did. It was the last recorded EP of the first block. Really ambitious sets, all the out door night street stuff was played in on the night, pre record. And
    the tag ending of the episode was recorded on a different day after the audience night, which ended in star bug.

    The one thing that made me go “awww” from recording. Is that Kryten’s sax solo has been edited out. For time i guess, or maybe in the edit it looked like it didnt work. But after the joke about apple bobbing and before the Cat’s little dance, there was a moment where Kryten had to load sax playing software to show he really was in the band and could play, and then Robert mimed a killer solo riff. Which he smegged up on at least one take.

    I love Kevin Eldon, especially at the “Offended moment” at the end, his face. He went off book on a couple of takes near the end, in saying sexy lines in character after the take had finished and had everyone falling about. I’ve been calling the exponoids the bitchy borg since last year. I absolutely love them. I can see the moans, like there was with the bad guys in
    The beginning etc being too comedy. When you’ve got the bitchy borg. Who cares. It’s delicious comedy. Kevin delivers it brilliantly. And well done Rebecca Blackstone too. I remember “Bob the bum” being say more on the night. I think there more celebrating with him or getting him to achieve, thats been a little edited down, or maybe im just remembering a few takes.

    The uktv player on my iphone was much more robust and wonderful, than whatever dave rewatch player i watched the last series on.

    Well done G&T for your banners system. great tech guys.

    Some interesting stuff in the title sequence.

  28. Overall a solid episode, I laughed whilst watching it but didn’t feel there were any absolutely huge woofs in there. 3 star episode.

    it begs the question of why Lister wouldn’t just stay there, rather than choose to go back to being marooned in deep space. I liked that they at least gave a story-specific reason for it this time, but the more the show goes back to this particular well the more strained it seems..

    Not Killing Kryten and Rimmer is the best explanation they have ever given for this. Far better than Tikka to ride’s “oh we had better not mess with the past” line. Though that does rule out anything before the three million years in our future period.

  29. Spin Kryten’s Nipple nuts!!!!! and Send me to The City on the Edge of Forever.

  30. Also…. don’t slay me for this (as I believe this, er, may have been briefly mentioned recently) but I really dislike how Kryten looks. I’m sure it’s a personal taste thing but, to me, he LOOKED like Kryten in Back to Earth and since then he’s looked like an attempted cosplay of Kryten that hasn’t quite got the angular features right.

    To be honest, I think Kryten looks fine this series. The costume and mask have always changed and evolved from series to series – probably the most consistent the design has ever been was between VII and VIII, and even then there were minor changes.

    Even though most of the costume is new this time around, for me the Series XI version seems like a more logical evolution of Back to Earth‘s Kryten costume than the Series X version did – it’s as if when designing it they reverted the general look back to 2009 as a starting point for designing their new version, keeping the more modern design elements introduced back then such as the solid leg plates and segmented under-carriage, but disregarding any Series X-specific changes such as the hook-nosed mask, shoulder hoops, widened neck-hole and more visible neck. It also seems to have gone back to the Series III-V costumes for inspiration in some instances, such as the lack of piping/visible LEDs around the shoulders (both of which have been on most costumes since Series VI), the higher shoulder-plates and the larger chest-monitor (which has been gradually shrinking from Series VI onwards). Finally, some things seem to be entirely new, such as this costume’s take on the chest and glove detailing, and the knee-pads added to the leg plates.

    As far as I’m concerned, although some aspects are different to what might have been expected it’s definitely very recognisably Kryten – certainly more so than the Series X version, in my opinion. I’m guessing it’ll probably stay much the same for at least the rest of this production run (i.e. Series XI and XII), so hopefully it’ll grow on people who haven’t warmed to it yet and not detract too much from their enjoyment of these brand new episodes.

  31. The new merch shop is now open!

    Cool a Bitchy Borg T-shirt! I might have to get that. Shame I wanted “I’d Do 7 of 9” though.

  32. Just watched it. It’s a fun opener for the new series, a big sci-fi adventure story that (as others have said) feels like a throwback to the middle era of the show, with some good gags and enjoyable ideas – the science-speakeasy was done brilliantly and made for some fun dialogue.

    Also, having The Actor Kevin Eldon as a guest star is never a bad thing.

    Some of the performances were a little bit broad (Chris Barrie in particular feels like he’s stage-acting a lot of the time – everything is very big, gestures and so on), but mostly it felt like a good return for the show.

    Plus, the model shots are lovely.

  33. G&T Admin

    By the way, I’ve changed the time on this post so that it still shows up above the new post on the front page. Don’t panic about the fact that comments are now showing us as having been posted before the article.

  34. The one thing that made me go “awww” from recording. Is that Kryten’s sax solo has been edited out. For time i guess, or maybe in the edit it looked like it didnt work. But after the joke about apple bobbing and before the Cat’s little dance, there was a moment where Kryten had to load sax playing software to show he really was in the band and could play, and then Robert mimed a killer solo riff.

    I was gutted they cut this bit out too, I remember it being very funny and getting a lot of laughs on the night!

    Also the tiny teaser from the set report was ‘Resistance Bunnies’, I couldn’t recall what that was about from the recording nor upon watching the episode, have I missed something or has that been cut too?

  35. Wow that was proper Red Dwarf, what a fantastic start to this new run of episodes. The main cast were on form as always but the guest cast’s accidents were a bit rough. Though I found this only enhanced my viewing experience as foreign accents have historically been a bit crap on Dwarf.

    After a single viewing I think I might rank this episode higher than anything in season 10, I’m curious to see how it holds up to repeat viewings.

  36. I enjoyed that a lot. A nice fun romp, though the pacing was a little too fast, it could have done with a few extra minutes. Also gutted at the lack of flyover at the end, would’ve really capped off the ep nicely.

    I’d need to rewatch it at least one, maybe five times first, but I thought it was better than a large part of X, maybe even all of X. It just really needed that extra bit of breathing room to push it from really good up to great.

  37. That was fantastic. Loved every minute of it, genuinely.

    Something I noticed though which is a little bit of silly fun to discuss … whenever there is a major change is the shows production, the first episode of the series is set on earth.

    S03E01 – Backwards. Huge set re-designs, new costumes … set on Earth.
    S07E01 – Tikka to Ride – 3 year gap in production New Starbug set, not filmed with an audience, going for a more filmic style etc … set on Earth.
    S09/BTE – 9 year gap in production. New sets, mostly CGI … set on Earth. (if you want to get picky, the first episode isn’t in anyway set on Earth, but taking as a whole, most of the action is there)

    and now S11E01 – 4 year gap in production, clearly increased production value, from all accounts to this point a massive improvement on S10 … set on Earth

  38. Also the tiny teaser from the set report was ‘Resistance Bunnies’, I couldn’t recall what that was about from the recording nor upon watching the episode, have I missed something or has that been cut too?

    The cop says it.

  39. the guest cast’s [accents] were a bit rough

    But all the Americans in it are American!

  40. Okay then! I really enjoyed that, some strong gags, great performances from the leads and guest stars and the model work was lovely. A few broad moments but that didn’t detract from a strong story concept. Kryten looks a bit fat and I know Bobby isn’t carrying extra weight so I guess the costume is just a little bit off. No complaints really, a good start to the new series!

  41. The 1920s accents did grate a tiny bit after a while, there have been a few people commenting on it on twitter

  42. The whole conceit of the Dwarfers being in possession of a device that enables time travel, yet all they want it for is to prop up all the pool table is absolutely wonderful. So beautifully Dwarf. The Niknak line is funny (and it’s referencing of modern brands not without precedent – see Bonjella and Pot Noodle.) The whole idea was executed marvelously – Doug firing on all cylinders. That speakeasy scene was breathtaking in it’s ideas and the dialogue truly inspired. I could go on. I’m running out of superlatives. A perfect series opener. Action packed adventure with great performances, concepts and laughs. Take a bow, Doug, the cast and everybody involved. *Applauds*.

  43. Also the tiny teaser from the set report was ‘Resistance Bunnies’, I couldn’t recall what that was about from the recording nor upon watching the episode, have I missed something or has that been cut too?

    The cop says it.

    Totally missed that bit! Shall listen out in the next of many rewatches!

  44. I liked the return of the ending style from series IV where Lister tells us the lesson he has learnt – only for it to be subverted and show that he hasn’t actually learned a thing.

    I also like the fact that Rimmer suggests Lister could stay on Earth but Lister won’t let Kryten die – an actual reason for them to not simply stay put! Immediately a better time travel story than “Tikka To Ride” just for giving the characters a motivation.

  45. And Cat doesn’t want to stay because his hair straighteners won’t work! Something so small, but, for the Cat, huge! Just brilliant.

  46. For want of a better phrase, this was the Dwarfiest episode of Dwarf since at least series 7. Really good fun. Jokes a little hackneyed at times with only a few that had me laughing (although mercifully none that had me cringing), but quite honestly it’s the characters, the performances and the story that matter most to me and they were top notch. Liked opening straight into the Starbug cockpit with no pissing about, getting the story going right away. Very, very good stuff.

  47. I was expecting better than Series X, and I think it delivered.

    I can see why they wanted this to be the premiere, it has so much more to offer than Trojan which (and I say this as someone who likes the episode) very much looks made on the cheap. This more than any post-1993 episode feels like a plot out of Series V or VI. I’ll have a lot more to say after I watch it second time and definitely as more episodes air, but on initial viewing this felt like everything good about Series X and then some.

    Also love the music cue I haven’t heard since Series I.

  48. Additional: I love the fact that we’ve had Kevin Eldon in an episode of Red Dwarf.

  49. Anyone else getting bidet adverts on UKTVPlay?

    Just tried to watch it again and it’s started me at the first ad break. This would be frustrating at the best of times, but given that it’s the first half I’d like to reassess, it seems even more so.

  50. Overall, I liked it. Good pace (something X lacked at times), excellent guest stars and a few really funny moments.

    The ‘cliché’ bit was interesting, as much of the plot certainly wasn’t original (it starts off as a typical VI episode, with elements seemingly nicked from Star Trek: First Contact, and ends up a fair bit like Lemons, down to finding a historical figure who turns out to be the wrong guy). But at least they called it out, and although that really shouldn’t allow you to get away with that, when it came round again at the end it was really funny.

    Mining quantum physics for comedy is something that’s always going to appeal to me. And Doug really did his homework on this and made it work really well.

    One odd question: was this an alternate universe episode or a time travel one? It was billed as the former, but seemed to be the latter, but given all the upheaval caused, did a substantial part of the history of the Red Dwarf universe just get changed with no effect whatsoever?

    In the end, comparing it to X, I’d say it wasn’t as good as The Beginning, on a par with Lemons (it’s hard to separate the two and I’d need rewatches to decide which I prefer) and better than the rest.

    Finally, who’d have ever thought Kevin Eldon would appear in Game of Thrones and Red Dwarf in the same year?

  51. A little disappointed we didn’t get a credits fly-over, but judging from the attempted one from Series X the new model just doesn’t have the kind of details to make it visually interesting.

    got abit corny like with the villains at the end

    They weren’t a constant on-screen presence directly threatening the Dwarfers like the simulant in Justice, for example. These guys were grunts, going around and enforcing laws. The threat came from their position rather than the individuals themselves. I can understand that a lot of us want some more serious villains like we had in the old days, but I think we can expect that creepy organ-thieving droid from Give & Take to satisfy us there (and of course other potential villains we have no idea exist yet). I think making the expenoids (love the name, no idea how to spell it) totally serious would have just hurt the comedy of the episode.

    Also are we waiting for the broadcast to do the opening montage analysis?

  52. Also are we waiting for the broadcast to do the opening montage analysis?

    Hope not, but only because I’d selfishly like to see such an article as soon as is humanly possible, haha. = P

  53. UKTV Website seems to be working fine, but the android app seems to be broken now when trying to view the episode (it was working earlier).

  54. Second watch through, enjoyed the first half much more. Maybe it’s just changed expectations. I hated Fathers and Suns on first watch but it grew on me a lot.

    Interested to see the discussion on the female characters in this. Overall I was impressed with the fact that an attractive female character wasn’t lusted after at all, and played a pivotal part of the plot of saving the world. Just good to see a strong, confident female character in the show, the complete opposite of Irene, really.

  55. Also are we waiting for the broadcast to do the opening montage analysis?

    Yeah, there’s some really exciting stuff in there, although surprisingly a lot of stuff from Twentica. The one I’m most curious about is the four dancing Rimmers.

  56. G&T Admin

    Also are we waiting for the broadcast to do the opening montage analysis?

    Tomorrow. It’s on tomorrow’s goal list.

    (Although it might end up being Saturday. Either way – before broadcast.)

  57. If anyone is still in any doubt, I assume that Twentica refers to an America that is stuck in the 1920’s.

  58. There was a lot I liked that that episode….infact I loved most of it. However I feel that stuff fizzled a bit the flat jokes involving the Simulants bickering and the rushed ending were a little disappointing for what was an otherwise very strong episode. It was definitely a really ambitious episode but it’s such a shame it felt like it ran out of time and really rushed a conclusion.

  59. I want to update my review of this episode. It works FAR better on the small screen than it does in a cinema filled with giant sized boxes of popcorn and people who laugh obnoxiously loud at every second frame. There’s a lot to like and the show looks incredible, and the opening credits are easily the best that the show’s had since series 6. In fact, the ONLY things I personally DIDN’T like are as follows:

    1. The opening scene in starbug, although some fine moments (and visually very cool looking), Craig and Chris were quite broad with the performances, whereas Robert and Danny were pitch perfect as always. It’s a shame really, as Rimmer used to be the character I loved to watch the most. He does get better as the episode goes on, but at the beginning it’s like watching ‘Red Dwarf The Stage Play’ (which I’d actually love to see) — in-episode, I just want them to tame down the breadth of the performance a little instead of teetering close to the edge of self-parody (and, no – before anyone puts the word in my mouth – I don’t mean ‘pantomime’ this time around!).

    What’s more, I’m not a fan of how the character names are worked into the dialogue in these scenes and the subsequent delivery of said names – – it feels very forced and unnatural to me when Rimmer ends a sentence with ‘Lister’ (or vice-versa).

    One last point: I’d like to hear the semblance of a Liverpudlian accent from Craig — it would help, even if it was a minor amount, just to remind me that, yeah, he’s been out in deep space, but he’s still the same guy we met in series 1-6.

    Finally, random thought: did anyone notice how much more ‘in character’ Chris and Lister LOOK when they’re wearing hats? Odd thing to point out, I know, but it also takes a good ten years off of them. If you were to take Rimmer’s hair from seasons 5/6 (which is totally possible with the lace wigs that they use on Red Dwarf now), then I think Rimmer would ‘feel’ a lot more like Rimmer for a greater percentage of the time (more ‘springy-ness’, less recession).

    All of that said — I really enjoyed Twentica on a second watch. Not a classic, the ending was a little flat, but over all a solid start and I’ve got a feeling that it will probably grow on me even more with subsequent watches.

  60. I want to update my review of this episode. It works FAR better on the small screen than it does in a cinema filled with giant sized boxes of popcorn and people who laugh obnoxiously loud at every second frame. There’s a lot to like and the show looks incredible, and the opening credits are easily the best that the show’s had since series 6. In fact, the ONLY things I personally DIDN’T like are as follows:

    1. The opening scene in starbug, although some fine moments (and visually very cool looking), Craig and Chris were quite broad with the performances, whereas Robert and Danny were pitch perfect as always. It’s a shame really, as Rimmer used to be the character I loved to watch the most. He does get better as the episode goes on, but at the beginning it’s like watching ‘Red Dwarf The Stage Play’ (which I’d actually love to see) — in-episode, I just want them to tame down the breadth of the performance a little instead of teetering close to the edge of self-parody (and, no – before anyone puts the word in my mouth – I don’t mean ‘pantomime’ this time around!).
    What’s more, I’m not a fan of how the character names are worked into the dialogue in these scenes and the subsequent delivery of said names – – it feels very forced and unnatural to me when Rimmer ends a sentence with ‘Lister’ (or vice-versa).
    One last point: I’d like to hear the semblance of a Liverpudlian accent from Craig — it would help, even if it was a minor amount, just to remind me that, yeah, he’s been out in deep space, but he’s still the same guy we met in series 1-6.
    Finally, random thought: did anyone notice how much more ‘in character’ Chris and Lister LOOK when they’re wearing hats? Odd thing to point out, I know, but it also takes a good ten years off of them. If you were to take Rimmer’s hair from seasons 5/6 (which is totally possible with the lace wigs that they use on Red Dwarf now), then I think Rimmer would ‘feel’ a lot more like Rimmer for a greater percentage of the time (more ‘springy-ness’, less recession).
    All of that said — I really enjoyed Twentica on a second watch. Not a classic, the ending was a little flat, but over all a solid start and I’ve got a feeling that it will probably grow on me even more with subsequent watches.

    The bit about using the characters name all the time is endemic of all TV though, not just Red Dwarf. If you talk to someone in real life, you’re very unlikely to use their name other than maybe at the start to get their attention, but during conversations it’d be really unlikely that you would. TV does it, in part I think, so that the audience, especially a very casual one, can pick up whose who quickly and follow along. It’s especially important in the opening episode of a new series that hasn’t been on in 4 years. That opening sequence is reintroducing us to all the characters again, and so, as unnatural as it is, names will be used with abundance.

  61. Good episode. As people have said, it was hit and miss with a few jokes, but I think the one’s that hit were brilliant. I actually really enjoyed the “slagging off” confrontation between the two droids; it seemed like a very Dwarfy juxtaposition for these killing machines to hurt each other’s feelings. The pool table stuff was gold as well.

    It did feel like it could have been TV movie length, which would have been nice. I just wanted more I suppose, luckily that’s coming next week!

  62. Well I have to say I absolutely loved that. Great story, some cracking gags and I cannot believe that was a multi-camera sitcom. Looked brilliant. All the illegal science dialogue was the best part of it.

    Sorry I know that’s overly positive, but I genuinely did like it that much. My only real criticism is i think the scenes about the Dwarf at the end of the episode were a bit too moody lighting wise.

  63. Also, i forgot to mention the quality of the model shots, which were spectacular. My favourite shot, though not actually a model shot entirely, is the interior shot looking out of Starbugs front windows as it was crashing with all the monitors below it. Looked filmic. And not the crap field removal filmic, proper filmic :)

  64. The bit about using the characters name all the time is endemic of all TV though, not just Red Dwarf. If you talk to someone in real life, you’re very unlikely to use their name other than maybe at the start to get their attention, but during conversations it’d be really unlikely that you would. TV does it, in part I think, so that the audience, especially a very casual one, can pick up whose who quickly and follow along. It’s especially important in the opening episode of a new series that hasn’t been on in 4 years. That opening sequence is reintroducing us to all the characters again, and so, as unnatural as it is, names will be used with abundance.

    Agreed (I’m a writer, so I do recognise – and frequently use – the convention), I was just trying to explain that I’m not a fan of the delivery (both written and performed). To me it’s jarring, but maybe I pick up on this more than most people? Entirely possible given the job description.

    P.S. Have to point out, that although this is airing as episode one, it wasn’t actually scripted or shot in that sequence…

  65. The one I’m most curious about is the four dancing Rimmers.

    When Howard Goodall said he was recording “Quartet of Rimmers”, I didn’t think he was literally recording a barbershop quartet of Arnold Rimmers. I hope we get a full number out of them, we haven’t had a proper song since Series VII.

  66. He’s he’s he’s he’s Arnold Arnold Arnold Arnold Arnold Arnold Arnold Arnold Arnold Arnold Arnold Arnold Rimmer Rimmer Rimmer Rimmer.

  67. If anyone’s got a YouView box then Twentica is available on there on demand (although posting that in here where everyone’s already watched it might not be much use). Still, beats watching it on a a laptop.

  68. Question: when the baddies said they have a human prisoner, was anyone else worried for a second it was going to be Kochanski? XD

  69. I did think they’d add a joke with Lister thinking it was Kochanski.

  70. 5-star premise, 1-star jokes. Averages out to a 2.5-star episode for me. It’s still better than most of RDX, mind, which is encouraging, but overall I’m disappointed.

    I really wanted to like it. Red Dwarf hasn’t looked this good in ages, and the cast seem to have dialed back the over-the-topedness from X a little. But a lot of the jokes needed polish. They weren’t up to snuff.

  71. Yeah I really enjoyed it. It killed anything from Series VII and VIII and most of X although I think in X Trojan and The Beginning was excellent episodes and deserve to be up there with this also X is way better than VII and VIII. But yeah I’m very happy with it you can see the difference in affects from X and XI it looks far more polished. The only criticisms is that although I protested at the time I think Twentica was the right choice as the first episode because it falls flat at the end and that wouldn’t have gone well as a final episode and maybe now thinking about it Can Of Worms as a final episode may be a more explosive end to the Series with Cats sexuality involved. Then only other criticism was Kryten yes Kryten. Nothing wrong with the costume as most moan about but he did seem a bit more padded you can see weight has been gained heck he is 60 but you notice, and the mask. Yes it is much improved from X but still not 100 percent right. That’s it though thoroughly enjoyed it. Effort was made and the special affects was quality, the sets in America and Starbug was quality. Most of the Red Dwarf crew looked well. The guest stars went well they was great choices. Some good jokes. I missed the crashes on Starbug I enjoyed it on this episode. The Kryten nipple attachment was clever. The Red Dwarf crew wind ups was back. It was quality. It was better than most things since 1993 except the couple I mentioned in X that deserved to be up there as well. But yeah happy and excited, and looking forward to more to come. I do have a feeling the more I watch this episode I will love it more and more.

  72. Did anyone catch the last words spoken? After Kryten says “open”. You can see that his mouth is closed, and Lister’s mouth is of course full, so who is speaking, and what is it that’s said? I can’t make it out. Is it meant to be Lister, and it’s just been badly dubbed?

  73. I liked it, i thought it was a good story and looked fantastic. Not laugh out loud funny or anything but I enjoyed it a lot. The mrs really liked that lady who was talking all the science stuff (cant for the life of me remember her name now)

  74. Lister says ‘Ah, that’s the lad’. I’m not sure it’s a dub though after trying the grimace myself and saying those words. I was 90% successful.

  75. Lister says ‘Ah, that’s the lad’. I’m not sure it’s a dub though after trying the grimace myself and saying those words. I was 90% successful.

    Just tried it myself; and you’re right, yes you can pretty much say that phrase entirely through clenched teeth! Brilliant – thanks for saving my sanity.

  76. I think modding the actor Kevin Eldon’s voice so much was a mistake.

    And the audience really likes Scot frying jokes now..?

  77. Coincidentally, through clenched teeth, that’s how you pronounce tarantula.

    And fenis.

  78. Delurking to toss in my tuppence (so to speak).

    Watched it a couple of times now and over all, disappointed.

    It looked great, it just wasn’t very funny. A couple of laugh out loud moments; pram full of string, Cat being disparaging of Rimmer – the first couple of times, at least…

    Other than that, the gags were telegraphed and hackneyed in a VII / VIII way. At this point, the running Chris Barrie’s mugging is reaching unbearable levels. The audience is perpetually in hysterics over nothing, which makes the lesser jokes seem even weaker.

    The plot was strong, though too big for half an hour – lots of rattling through exposition.

    Kevin Eldon was good, though didn’t have much to work with.

    Bah. I wanted love it, I just didn’t.

  79. It’s not often I post on G&T but I just have to for this! Overall I thought this was a so-so episode. A bit Season VII in quality. Not awful but by no means a classic. Some specific thoughts…

    – Superb production values in the sets, lighting, and VFX. I don’t think Red Dwarf has ever looked so good!
    – For me it took a long time for the episode to warm up and by the ad break I was distinctly worried, but the laughs came thick and fast in the second half at least.
    – The Einstein reveal got the biggest laugh from me but it did feel like a retread of Jesus in Lemons.
    – I really don’t like the door at the back of the Starbug cockpit. Makes it feel much more like a set. I’m sure this could have been avoided with a digital backdrop.
    – I don’t really understand how the crew got back to their own time at the end or why they’d really want to – this is something where it would have actually made sense for Lister to mention that they need to get back to find Kochanski.
    – As a series opener it didn’t feel as confident or important as Trojan. Felt much more like a middle of the series episode.
    – It was wonderful to see Kevin Eldon. He’s a great comedy talent and he made the most of the role. It’s just a shame that his personality didn’t get a chance to shine through so much under the make-up and robotic personality. He got some great lines towards the end though.
    – Nice to see Rebecca Blackstone get another role!
    – The idea of Rimmer being stolen from the future and used as a hostage really caught my imagination at the start. I think they could have done more with this concept.
    – Rimmer dancing raised a giggle.

  80. I thought it was…fine?

    There were bits I liked, but the one-liners were generally weak (this has been the case with all Dave Dwarf IMHO) and I never really bought into the premise.

    There was nothing in it that annoyed me particularly, no shopping channel/Taiwan Tony-esque bugbears, but overall I thought it felt a bit flat. Hope I warm to it on second viewing.

  81. While not perfect, I will say that I am happy that I have a season opener that I legitimately think is a good episode….particularly given how weak I found (and still do) Trojan to be. I am starting to feel more optimistic about this new series as a whole……I hope this sets a standard for the rest of the episodes to come.

  82. And the audience really likes Scot frying jokes now..?

    Oof, that was a bad one. Probably my least favourite line in the episode. Reminded me of an VIII joke.

  83. And the audience really likes Scot frying jokes now..?

    Oof, that was a bad one. Probably my least favourite line in the episode. Reminded me of an VIII joke.

    Funnily enough, this went down really well at the screening I attended … in Edinburgh.

  84. And the audience really likes Scot frying jokes now..?

    Oof, that was a bad one. Probably my least favourite line in the episode. Reminded me of an VIII joke.

    As a throwaway gag it’s OK, it’s just the fucking applause that greets it…

  85. Question: when the baddies said they have a human prisoner, was anyone else worried for a second it was going to be Kochanski? XD

    Yep! I really thought it would be her. Which made the reveal so much funnier actually.

  86. > Question: when the baddies said they have a human prisoner, was anyone else worried for a second it was going to be Kochanski? XD

    > I did think they’d add a joke with Lister thinking it was Kochanski.

    No, because Doug obviously doesn’t want to be responsible for John doing a Father Jack-style window run, mid-episode…:p

  87. Yeah, I was expecting it to be Kochanski and was really surprised they’d put her in so early. Surprised and relieved to see Rimmer.

  88. – I don’t really understand how the crew got back to their own time at the end or why they’d really want to – this is something where it would have actually made sense for Lister to mention that they need to get back to find Kochanski.

    They used the chronos thingy that Kryten snatched from Kevin Eldon, didn’t they?

    Makes no sense why they wouldn’t at least consider going back to Earth, though… if the device can apparently take them anywhere, any time.

    Bit like the time drive again, innit. Exactly like it, in fact.

    Maybe the quest for Kochanski now takes precedence over getting home. Or maybe Lister’s developed an odd form of Stockholm syndrome and now actually enjoys being stranded in the distant future / deep space with the gang.

    Actually, him realising that would be a decent end to the series over all. His “home” is now the status quo with which we’re all so familiar.

  89. – Rimmer dancing raised a giggle.

    I’d completely forgotten about that but as soon as I read that, the image came into my head and I started laughing. So I guess that counts as a quality visual gag then.

  90. Rimmer attempting the Charleston was a great visual gag.

  91. They have access to another device that apparently lets you go anywhere in time and space, but choose to go back to the far lonely future?

    They have the ability to travel in time, not space, which is ultimately pointless. I believe that was addressed in series VI.

    Edit: Actually, ignore everything i just said.

  92. Can anyone who saw the preview screenings elaborate on the edits that have been made since?

  93. They have the ability to travel in time, not space, which is ultimately pointless. I believe that was addressed in series VI.

    In VII the time drive could go anywhere, anywhen. That’s how get back to Earth.

    This new doohickey must also allow for travel through space, otherwise they wouldn’t have ended up on Earth. Unless it only works like that when plugged into the Simulant’s ship.

    *shrugs*

  94. Not much left to say that hasn’t been said – my gripes have all already been largely laid out (broad performances in the beginning).
    The Mars Bar joke I enjoyed, and I’m Scottish. I found it funnier than “the salad section of a Scottish supermarket”, which, while delightfully alliterative, feels like a joke you’d hear on a post-Boyle Mock The Week. But yes, the audience do seem to be a bit too eager these days.

    Did anyone else feel like the episode went by INCREDIBLY quickly? There was almost no breathing space, we went from one scene to the next at breakneck speed, etc. Some of the exposition in Starbug was done over the laughter from a previous joke, but to me that felt like the performer’s waiting for the laugh to die down had been edited out with the laugh kept in tact. Maybe it was just all the adrenaline pumping through me as I was watching a FANTASTIC new episode of Red Dwarf for the first time in 4 years.

    Also, the model shots are good, but there’s just something SO good about the ones from the 80s and 90s that I don’t think we will ever surpass, on Dwarf or anything else ever again.

  95. This new doohickey must also allow for travel through space, otherwise they wouldn’t have ended up on Earth. Unless it only works like that when plugged into the Simulant’s ship.
    *shrugs*

    My guess it maybe they could only retrace the time tunnel the Sims went through, I mean maybe they didn’t have all the needed tech to properly use it as a full fledged time machine……but that is purely speculation.

  96. In VII the time drive could go anywhere, anywhen. That’s how get back to Earth.
    This new doohickey must also allow for travel through space, otherwise they wouldn’t have ended up on Earth. Unless it only works like that when plugged into the Simulant’s ship.
    *shrugs*

    Well, dang. There must be some reason for it. I like the idea that they boys just feel like Red Dwarf IS their home now (coupled with Lister’s insistence that they need to find Kochanski). I mostly like this because it ensures we will have more episodes of our favourite show – if they went back in time to 2290’s Earth or whatever the show would be over!

  97. Can anyone who saw the preview screenings elaborate on the edits that have been made since?

    I’m pretty certain that in the hatch scene, the Cat introduced Rimmer before Lister.

    Also, at the recording there was a scene I loved, a getaway scene after the bar that was shot like an old black and white gangster flick. I asked Doug about it at the Manchester screening a few weeks back and he said in the context of the episode it just didn’t work.

    Also, I like Twentica.

  98. Funnily enough, this went down really well at the screening I attended … in Edinburgh.

    Which is fine, that type of joke has been around since The End, it’s just the sizeable reaction to it threw me.

    “Probably hate the third largest city in Vietnam, then…”

    Ha HA haha

  99. Has there ever been so many rounds of applause in a single episode?

  100. It’s probably worth noting that this episode was recorded last out of the six, and so there was a very “end of term” atmosphere around the place generally – it was only about a week before Christmas, too. The Lady be Good stuff, in particular, got more and more raucous as things went on. This might explain why the audience seemed particularly applause/whoop friendly.

    (I really, really hope that the Smeg Ups include some of Kevin Eldon’s alternate adlibs for his “So, we meet again” line – he had to feed it a few times without his line actually being needed in the take, so started to mix it up)

  101. I don’t think there’s any plot hole as to why the Dwarfers don’t use that particular device to just go back to Earth. The villains needed it to boost their own advanced technology, so I don’t think the device itself was entirely responsible for that range of travel. And then, the villains and their ship (and presumably the portal thingy) got destroyed by the burst on the planet – which was why our group couldn’t stay, due to Kryten and Rimmer – and so when they re-emerge into space, they wouldn’t have been able to use it in the same way because their ship doesn’t have the same capabilities for it to magnify.

    That’s pretty solid isn’t it? By Dwarf standards, at least.

  102. G&T Admin

    I thought it started really well, but felt the plot tailed off a bit. Great guest appearances, though.

  103. That does make sense, aye.

    The logic is good. I just wish it had been funnier. Been waiting since the cliffhanger of Out of Time for it to recapture the glory days and am always let down to varying degrees.

    Peak Dwarf was sarcastic, flippant, thoughtful, dry, ridiculous and clever.

    I still love it these days. It just takes more effort.

  104. I think it’s telling that a lot of people have enjoyed it regardless of the fact that they didn’t laugh much / at all. Doug’s certainly recaptured a lot of the spirit and the feel of the show that the fans love, but the comedy is still diluted a little.

  105. Oof, that was a bad one. Probably my least favourite line in the episode. Reminded me of an VIII joke.

    The premise was solid. The wording, not so much. I feel like that joke – and a lot of jokes in this, actually – were just a quick polish away from being truly brilliant instead of just sort-of there.

  106. I tried to watch this episode over skype (I live in the US but my family are in the UK) but I couldn’t hear all of the dialogue. My sister laughed very hard at the Mars bar joke and I enjoyed Cat in the first scene. Really want to watch it online somehow!

  107. Wanted to like it much more than I did but the overwhelming strangeness of tone was a barrier. The audience were alternately raucous and silent (very odd sound mix) which didn’t help, but that series V trap of packing in too much, doing a brutal edit-down and falling off a tightrope of incoherence came into play. It looked BEAUTIFUL though. I’ve a feeling my sort of stuff will be arriving later – this just didn’t feel like an opener, it was obviously not an episode 1.

  108. The audience were alternately raucous and silent (very odd sound mix)

    That was weird. The guffaws were overwhelming but a few bits, like the very first line – the rubber pantaloons one. Not a titter.

  109. It’s probably worth noting that this episode was recorded last out of the six, and so there was a very “end of term” atmosphere around the place generally – it was only about a week before Christmas, too. The Lady be Good stuff, in particular, got more and more raucous as things went on. This might explain why the audience seemed particularly applause/whoop friendly.

    So what was the recording order? May I ask?

  110. Oh yes, I forgot to mention the silences. There were four or five really good lines I recall not getting a single laugh. Cat’s ‘every cloud’ might have been overwhelmed by the absurd over-reaction to the Mars Bar joke, but others just had no response at all and I felt a bit odd laughing at them in silence.

  111. The one visual gag I liked the most was Jump-starting Kryten. It wasn’t too silly and thought was a great touch. Even the jump leads had JMC logo on them!

  112. Really intrigued to hear many comments about Twentica not being funny enough. I think it really highlights how difficult Doug’s job is, i.e. appealing to the broad range of comedy / jokes that fans crave.

    IMO, there were so many funny lines that I almost lost the thread of the plot.

    I liked the character-based jokes, e.g. Rimmer confidently declaring that we never negotiate with simulants before u-turning when the hostage is revealed to be him. Felt very established, classic.

    Kryten’s nipple nuts’ jump-start was wonderful – how have we not seen that before?

    The play on the underground, illicit, ‘den’ and the ‘smart’ science quips (‘density = mass/volume’ being a personal favourite) were superb.

    The ‘hackneyed clichés’ thread that runs throughout the episode gives plenty of opportunity for throwing in well-worn lines that nicely tone down what could otherwise have been a quite dark / serious episode.

    Very interested to see how this overall balance shifts as the series moves forward. Perhaps the success of the ‘classic’ era was due to the mixture of episodes – some darker, some lighter, but all with a splattering of a broad variety of jokes that appealed to at least a portion of the fans each week.

  113. I think this episode as comparable to Lemons, in that I don’t have any extreme reactions either way. I don’t think it was awful; It looked pretty, the structure of the story was fine and the performances were good. Aside from a couple of editing problems, this is as good as Red Dwarf has looked in years. The opening ten minutes in Starbug were great and I loved the idea of the temporal kidnap.

    But after that opener, it kinda lost me. The laughs dried up, the Einstein stuff was Lemons revisited and the plot rather fizzled out with a very contrived resolution. Wasn’t overly keen on the direction of the final scene either.

    I liked the explanation as to why they couldn’t stay (and the fact that they went to the trouble of making one), although it’s probably a little too late in the day for Lister expressing surprise at seeing other humans.

    In terms of post-Rob Dwarf, I’d place this below Tikka to Ride, Stoke, Trojan and The Beginning.

    A little disappointed as the hype for this particular episode was particularly high, but I think Officer Rimmer is better than this, so I’m not too worried.

    And, yeah, why was this called Twentica? Red Dwarf : First Contact would have made more sense.

  114. Really enjoyable. Definitely as good if not a bit better than the best episodes of X (Lemons and The Beginning) on first viewing. There were quite a few laughs in there for me and I really enjoyed a strong sci-fi plot where unlike X they went straight into the plot rather than hanging around. I was particularly amused by the Dwarfers’ efforts to blend in when the cops arrived at the speakeasy. The episode absolutely flew by, which I think is a good thing as a lot of the classic era Dwarf feels the same way. The production values were terrific and it definitely felt much more polished than any of series X. My brother enjoyed Twentica as well, despite some dispute with me over whether Rimmer was wearing an Ace Rimmer style wig when being held by captive. His hair does go quite floppy, but I think it was just meant to be disheveled.

  115. Yes, he looks shaken up which gives him a bit of a floppy fringe.

  116. I enjoyed it! It was very quick into the story but the cast seemed so immediately at home that I don’t think a lengthier opening was needed. The time travel plot was neat, the guest cast were all great, and there were some definite stand out funnies (Bob the Bum, Kryten’s explanation of his appearance, the science innuendo, the mere image of that toaster being smashed up). Have to agree with everyone else in thinking it was rushed at the end, though. It felt like it was one or two story beats short of me getting properly invested. Generally though, this is a good start! Looking forward to next week for sure.

    I also noticed that this had a minor problem in common with Tikka To Ride: the whole “the Dwarfers have space/time travel technology, but they don’t use it to get back to Earth in their own time” thing. However, UNLIKE Tikka, this episode actually acknowledges it, and takes the chance to make a joke about it. Huzzah!

    As far as the First-Episode-In-New-Full-Series-After-Lengthy-Hiatus ranking goes, my initial feeling is that Twentica is easily loads better than Tikka To Ride, but not quite as good as Trojan. Then again, Trojan has a melancholic, instrumental version of the Rimmer Munchkin Song in it, so it kind of wins by default.

    Wait… why IS it called ‘Twentica’? Because it’s set in a land that has been kept technologically in the Twenties? I feel dumb for being confused about this.

  117. despite some dispute with me over whether Rimmer was wearing an Ace Rimmer style wig when being held by captive. His hair does go quite floppy, but I think it was just meant to be disheveled.

    THE HAIR doesn’t work for me. The shorter Series X toup was much more natural looking. This.. thing just looks like a wig from every angle.

  118. (I really, really hope that the Smeg Ups include some of Kevin Eldon’s alternate adlibs for his “So, we meet again” line – he had to feed it a few times without his line actually being needed in the take, so started to mix it up)

    What he said.

    I will be outside GNP offices with a protest march if this doesnt happen. Especially cus someone said richard was asking what did people want on the extras. WE WANT KEVIN ELDON’S AD LIBBING IN CHARACTER. OR WE WILL CRY.

  119. Posted this in the wrong thread really, so I’m putting it here too..

    Danny John-Jules was straight into it, I think Chris is a bit on the nose and needs to relax into it, but wasn’t awful. Robert fluffed a couple of lines “astrophysists” I think was the worst one, Craig reminded me of the original run Lister in places which is great, the bit immediately after they crashed especially.

    The effects were hit and miss to me. Some of it is amazing, some, like the time tunnel, look naff. All the ships looked good (Starbug’s legs look really off though, they look wonky and weak).
    The episode was good though and I’m hopeful for the rest. Didn’t have enough of the main 4 in though for me, a large percentage of the lines were by the guest actors which always takes me out of it a bit, feels a bit alien.

    The nipple nuts were tremendous.

    All the time paradox stuff would surely be negated by the expenoids being killed in the past wouldn’t it, killed in the past, wouldn’t exist in the present to travel back to the past or something.

    Anyway, solid. Going to watch it again later but I’m saying it’s better than anything since the late 90’s.
    EDIT: OH! And where are my flyover end credits goddamnit!

  120. All the time paradox stuff would surely be negated by the expenoids being killed in the past wouldn’t it, killed in the past, wouldn’t exist in the present to travel back to the past or something.

    Thats perhaps as good as it’s going to get on any reset yeah. I watched again and I was looking at the fact they had the kronos back on star bug activated, but it’s not established to be anything that would reset. I guess we have to consider how much the bannana crisp sandwhich time slide of sticking one on Hitler did or didnt get reset etc! Red dwarf has not given a shit before now about being clear about it’s time lines being reknit to our own reality.

  121. Moaning about some of the jokes. I understand what some people mean about the scottish fried joke. If you put that on a peice of paper in a cracker etc. But in the reality of the moment of watching i actually laughed loudly at that. on the re watch just now i noted that ambiently it does come from Lister unexpectedly through smoke when you are expecting a damage report or serious drama of the crash to be a short moment. I think it’s excellently nodded into the net from that position.

  122. Watched it again with my partner who was a big fan in the 90’s but fell out of watching. I’ve shown her a few episodes of X and she thought this was far, far better.

  123. I don’t know about you guys but I was reeeeeeeeeally wanting to listen to a Live Dwarfcast after watching the ep yesterday (which is more a comment about the schedule than G&T’s pretty decent coverage plan).

  124. G&T Admin

    I’m just pleased we went through a launch day without our server shitting everywhere.

  125. By the way, whatever thread it was where I said I was hoping to see Kevin Eldon and Peter Serafinowicz in the new episodes, this means I am already 50% qualified to be a casting director on Red Dwarf.

    Next job: seduce Doug Naylor.

  126. G&T Admin

    All the time paradox stuff would surely be negated by the expenoids being killed in the past wouldn’t it, killed in the past, wouldn’t exist in the present to travel back to the past or something.

    Nah bruv, you can totally die in the past without undoing anything. If the Exponoids’ grandparents had been killed in the past, there’d be a paradox, but the Exponoids themselves being killed after thirty years of terror doesn’t change those thirty years.

  127. Yeah, the exponoids had a non-linear chronology, so A->B chronology doesn’t affect them. Killing them doesn’t affect what happened in *their* past.

  128. The way I’d reconcile it would be to assume that the Exponoids’ time-travel messing created a parallel universe in which the Dwarfers found themselves, rather than changing the actual one that they came from. And that the particular method of time-travel that they used to get home was also one that enabled them to get back onto their own timeline.

  129. Yes, it ties in with Kryten’s speech at the end of Back to Earth as well.

  130. “-ica: a collection of things that relate to a specific place, person, theme, etc.”

  131. Did it strike anyone as a little odd that Kryten didn’t know how to put that machine together that they needed “Einstein” for? Maybe not a stretch that it would beyond his knowledge, but a little odd they didn’t ask him at least. Maybe that was cut dialogue, given how jam-packed the plot was.

  132. Did it strike anyone as a little odd that Kryten didn’t know how to put that machine together that they needed “Einstein” for? Maybe not a stretch that it would beyond his knowledge, but a little odd they didn’t ask him at least. Maybe that was cut dialogue, given how jam-packed the plot was.

    Not really, I took it as Kryten going for logic over wasting time trying to solve the problem himself and thinking “obviously this is going to be far too advanced for me, I’ll get the genius I have access to” without actually looking at it or trying, which if he would have done, he’d have realised how simple it was.

  133. I like Rimmer’s hair a lot better in this series. X’s didn’t look nearly as good to me.

  134. Third viewing and it’s all fallen into place for me. Still think it’s too jarring for a Show 1, and a bit overloaded in the cut, but I’m happy to say it’s a Good Thing. Tiny points of interest:

    1. I was hugely distracted trying to place the Einstein/Bob actor from other things. He’s the mad farmer from Detectorists!

    2. Was that production music or real musicians on a Dwarf score for the first time since Stoke Me A Clipper?

    3. Craig Charles delivers that Mars joke in a really interesting way – like Lister’s coming up with a gag to make the Cat laugh. I like that.

  135. >>>I tried to watch this episode over skype (I live in the US but my family are in the UK) but I couldn’t hear all of the dialogue. My sister laughed very hard at the Mars bar joke and I enjoyed Cat in the first scene. Really want to watch it online somehow!

    There is a way…contact me. I think my account is linked to my FB page.

  136. 2. Was that production music or real musicians on a Dwarf score for the first time since Stoke Me A Clipper?

    I wouldn’t be at all surprised if it was composed for the show, but it’s probably a library piece. Speaking of music, I’m really disappointed we didn’t get a ’20s jazz remix of the Red Dwarf end theme (heavy on the clarinet, of course). I really, really hope Series XI/XII gives us at least one credits remix, although this here was a perfect opportunity.

    Still can’t get over that they threw out the Ace Rimmer end theme remix composed for Stoke Me a Clipper and just reprised the score from the cold opening. It’s the same style of music but specially made for the credits. Why would you throw it out? Why?

  137. That unused Stoke ending sounds a bit cheap to be honest. It almost sounds like a scratch demo for something they couldn’t budget into the orchestra session. Sampling’s moved on a lot in the 20 years since VII was made, thankfully.

    The unused Tikka ending is the real loss. They should have resurrected it for Lemons.

  138. Third viewing and it’s all fallen into place for me. Still think it’s too jarring for a Show 1, and a bit overloaded in the cut, but I’m happy to say it’s a Good Thing. Tiny points of interest:

    1. I was hugely distracted trying to place the Einstein/Bob actor from other things. He’s the mad farmer from Detectorists!
    2. Was that production music or real musicians on a Dwarf score for the first time since Stoke Me A Clipper?
    3. Craig Charles delivers that Mars joke in a really interesting way – like Lister’s coming up with a gag to make the Cat laugh. I like that.

    In reference to Number 3, just after Lister says the Mars Bar line, he says something else which the audience laugh at which I can’t quite hear and then Cat replies: ‘Every cloud,” or something like that. Can anyone make out what Lister’s line is?

  139. Well I enjoyed it for the most part. Yes they played the sci-fi up a little and the comedy down a little for this ep but that is ok by me as an occasional thing :)

  140. I like Rimmer’s hair a lot better in this series. X’s didn’t look nearly as good to me.

    But… it looks like a wig, whereas it didn’t in X most of the time. This just looks like an old Rimmer in a floppy rug, which ages him horribly.

  141. >>Can anyone make out what Lister’s line is?

    He says “Rimmer is out, too.”

  142. >>Can anyone make out what Lister’s line is?

    He says “Rimmer is out, too.”

    Thanks! Wonder why the audience didn’t laugh at “Every cloud!”

    Presumably they missed it from laughing at the Mars Bar gag.

  143. Having re-watched the episode I feel a bit more at ease with it but I still don’t find it funny enough.

    Case in point: The joke where Rimmer gets annoyed that he hasn’t been asked if he has any ideas. The punchline is totally telegraphed and predictable to the point where I just didn’t find it funny at all. But I feel like in the Grant-Naylor days it would have been given a bit more room to develop, perhaps the conversation would have progressed a bit further with an opportunity for a second punchline that’s much more surprising.

    A good example of this is the conversation in Marooned about Lister losing his virginity on a golf course. The reveal that he was aged 12 is a joke you see coming a mile off as soon as Rimmer asks how old he was but then you get a healthy pause and then the much funnier reaction from Rimmer to say “you can’t have been a full member of the golf club then”.

    This is the sort of thing I find a bit lacking in modern Dwarf. Maybe it’s because there’s just one writer instead of two, or maybe it’s because there’s also a bit more emphasis on moving the plot along, but it feels like some jokes are a little under-developed and never get to the killer punchline they’re capable of.

  144. Case in point: The joke where Rimmer gets annoyed that he hasn’t been asked if he has any ideas. The punchline is totally telegraphed and predictable to the point where I just didn’t find it funny at all.

    I feel that a joke can be predictable as all hell but still funny. There is no rule that says all comedy is based on the element of surprise. In this case, I thought it was handled well because although it will clear that Rimmer wouldn’t have an idea, the delivery of his exasperated “no” without missing a beat after Lister’s question was still funny.

    I thought there was a great mix of Dwarf-y gags (surely the only other show that could pull off the “how dense do you think I am?” gag as well would be The Big Bang Theory, and then only by one very specific character) and broader gags, and overall it was a funny episode. Not every joke hit the mark and we can all pick out jokes that weren’t great, but give us an episode of Fawlty Towers or Only Fools and we can still pick out jokes that aren’t fantastic – but no-one would deny they were funny episodes.

  145. I feel that a joke can be predictable as all hell but still funny. There is no rule that says all comedy is based on the element of surprise. In this case, I thought it was handled well because although it will clear that Rimmer wouldn’t have an idea, the delivery of his exasperated “no” without missing a beat after Lister’s question was still funny.

    Agreed, I think that was actually a case of the joke being done well. The pace and intonation of Rimmer’s response I found really funny. In contrast, I thought some of the Starbug-based examples of this kind of joke were a bit tired.

  146. [url=https://postimg.org/image/ehygqk3kv/][img]https://s3.postimg.org/e572kdlb7/image.jpg[/img][/url][url=https://postimage.org/]photo sharing websites[/url]

  147. I feel that a joke can be predictable as all hell but still funny. There is no rule that says all comedy is based on the element of surprise. In this case, I thought it was handled well because although it will clear that Rimmer wouldn’t have an idea, the delivery of his exasperated “no” without missing a beat after Lister’s question was still funny.

    I just really like that Rimmer just wants to be validated so bad that he gets offended when nobody wants to ask his opinion on something he openly admits to being clueless about. To me it wasn’t the line itself that was funny, it was what it says about Rimmer that he would even say something like that.

    I’m actually surprised more people than me seem to like it. I just assumed everybody would hate it for being so telegraphed.

  148. there are definitely some jokes that feel like the set up is too long or Doug rides a joke abit to long.

    Its like when Kryten is explaining how Rimmer could be kidnapped if he is on starbug at the same time, it was in 3 phases with Kryten giving one explanation with Rimmer adding “so not the end of the world then” and then kryten gives another and Rimmer says it again, i feel like it should have just been in 2 phases only where Kryten would have explained both at the same time and then rimmer says “not the end of the world then” and then kryten explains the 3rd possible option and cat cracks the not the end of the world gag pay off, the set up would have flowed much quicker.

  149. Classic ‘rule of three’ gag. I don’t think I’ll ever tire of Cat’s zingers like that (all in all, 100% successful trip!), but it probably needed tightening up somehow to make it snappier. Still pretty good though.

  150. Dax, rule of three as a successful comedy device is something that can be proven with, like, graphs and stuff.

  151. I don’t know what the rule of three is but i still felt it could have got to the punchline quicker with bigger punch if the set up was trimmed down abit.

  152. G&T Admin

    I thought that bit had a nice rhythm to it. It’s like Doug’s little writing foibles have gone through a few more stages of polish.

  153. Rule of three is a noted stylistic device, not just in comedy but in all forms of writing, based around the premise that groups of items feel inherently more satisfying in threes. There’s been all sorts of writing and analysis dedicated to trying to figure out why it is, but it’s an observation that goes back at least as far as the Romans, who called it omne trium perfectum.

    In comedy, the third element is the one that plays on the element of surprise, after the first two have established a pattern. If you change the format after only one example, then you haven’t established that pattern and so you don’t get the same dissonance.

    Genuinely, if the Cat’s “So, if he dies…” had come after only one example of it from Rimmer, it would have felt to me like a botched and awkward attempt at a gag – it needs the three there for the rhythm to work.

  154. Ironically enough, if you’re a writer, you’ll recognise the ‘rule of three’ as a hackneyed, old cliche.
    (for the record — I LIKED the joke).

  155. A hackeyed old cliché that appears in absolutely everything ever because it works like nothing else.

    The alternative is “oi Marley, how many ghosts have you got left now? I’m knackered and it’s already fucking Boxing Day.”

  156. “Twentica” is derived from “TWENTies amerICA”, I think

  157. Caved in and watched it. Enjoyed it. Not as funny as I thought it’d be, but still plenty to amuse. Kryten’s nipple nuts in particular amused me a great deal, but then I like silliness like that.

    Rimmer’s hair looks fine – better than RDX in my humble opinion, definitely better than in BtE. Kryten looks fine, too.

    Classic ‘rule of three’ gag. I don’t think I’ll ever tire of Cat’s zingers like that

    You gotta think ahead!

  158. I think having the set up go on to long just makes it easier to see where its heading.

    Doug has done it a few times in Series X.

  159. A hackeyed old cliché that appears in absolutely everything ever because it works like nothing else.

    In the past. That’s how it has come to be known as a ‘hackneyed old cliche’. Take it from someone who writes for a living.

  160. Firstly, you’re not the only person in this thread who writes for a living. Secondly, fuck the suggestion that only people who write for a living are allowed to have an opinion on textual analysis.

  161. And just because something is a common rhetoric or stylistic device, doesn’t mean that by its nature it is automatically a “hackneyed old cliche”. I could just as easily argue that you using the phrase “Take it from someone who…” is a hackneyed old cliche. Even “hackneyed old cliche” itself is a hackneyed old cliche.

  162. And just because something is a common rhetoric or stylistic device, doesn’t mean that by its nature it is automatically a “hackneyed old cliche”. I could just as easily argue that you using the phrase “Take it from someone who…” is a hackneyed old cliche. Even “hackneyed old cliche” itself is a hackneyed old cliche.

    Yes, but I didn’t use it in a shooting script.

    Nice strawman there, too. I never even hinted at the idea that other people couldn’t have an opinion on ‘textual analysis’ if they don’t write for a living, however, they’d be a hell of a lot better informed about what it is that they’re attempting to argue about if they did. For the record, I’ve been writing professionally for over a decade now (and no, not on the internet). My latest project is a west end/Broadway musical for a major music franchise with a budget of $23 million. That’s not any kind of a boast or an ego trip — it’s just the facts.

    Like I said in my original post — I actually liked the joke. The lines worked well. If you can’t admit that there’s a certain amount of irony in the conceit of using the rule of three (largely considered cliche by, well, pick a working writer/author) in an episode of a show which itself makes a point out of commenting on hackneyed old cliches, then there’s not a lot that I can do to help you. Does it work in comedy? Sure does — arguably a lot better than it would hold up in most other genres. But the fact remains: rule of three — writer’s cliche. They actually teach you NOT to use that shit in writing classes, post-grad courses, and, well, pretty much anywhere else that teaches and tutors in writing publishable fiction. My post above wasn’t intended as criticism towards Doug Naylor, I was just pointing out that it was a somewhat amusing and ironic conceit. I’m sure it’s not lost on Doug — who, for all we know, may well have written those lines intentionally with this in mind. Maybe, maybe not. Who knows.

  163. I think the rule of three is way too old to be a hackneyed old cliche by now. It’s a dramatic and comedic structure that works. You might as well say one liners or humorous subversions are hackneyed old cliches.

  164. An Englishman and a Scotsman walk into a bar.
    Nothing else happens of any note.

  165. “The fourth bowl of porridge was of fairly similar temperature to the third thought Goldilocks, but she ploughed on anyway, not wanting to be a cliche. By the ninth, they were all stone cold anyway so she just had Shreddies.”

  166. You do know that just listing three things (an Englishman, an Irish man, and a Scotsman – for example) — isn’t even remotely close to the (hackneyed old cliche that is) the writing convention of ‘the rule of three’? Good . I thought you did. I was just checking.

    Same goes for you, too, Goldilocks.

  167. They actually teach you NOT to use that shit in writing classes, post-grad courses, and, well, pretty much anywhere else that teaches and tutors in writing publishable fiction.

    Oh, well, if they teach you it in writing courses, then it’s definitely a rule that always has to be followed. As we all know, every great writer in history got where they did by following arbitrary rules laid down in writing courses to the letter.

    My latest project is a west end/Broadway musical for a major music franchise with a budget of $23 million. That’s not any kind of a boast or an ego trip — it’s just the facts.

    It absolutely is a massive boast, and you know it.

    It’s also completely irrelevant to the conversation. Just because you’re a successful writer who learned how to do things one way doesn’t mean that the way you work is “correct”. If you want to pay attention to rules laid down by other people, then fine. I prefer to go by the argument that the only rule in writing is that there are no rules. And I’m far from alone in that.

    (Incidentally, I’ve got a degree in English Language and Literature from Oxford University. Does that make me “better informed” on what makes writing work than you, or less? Is there a handy diagram or sliding scale we can look at, just so we can make sure we all know exactly where we fall in the hierarchy?)

    The reason I don’t think rule of three is a “writer’s cliche” is that it’s something far larger than that. It’s an innate part of human instinct. Is it commonly used? Yes. Does it work? Absolutely. Because it triggers a neurological response.

  168. You do know that just listing three things (an Englishman, an Irish man, and a Scotsman – for example) — isn’t even remotely close to the (hackneyed old cliche that is) the writing convention of ‘the rule of three’? Good . I thought you did. I was just checking.

    The Englishman, Irishman, Scotsman joke is about as textbook an example of rule of three in comedy as you can get. I’m convinced you’re just trolling, now.

  169. >You do know that just listing three things (an Englishman, an Irish man, and a Scotsman – for example) — isn’t even remotely close to the (hackneyed old cliche that is) the writing convention of ‘the rule of three’?

    The form of “an Englishman, an Irish man, and a Scotsman” joke uses the rule of three. I’m not sure why you’re disputing this.

  170. The form of “an Englishman, an Irish man, and a Scotsman” joke uses the rule of three. I’m not sure why you’re disputing this.

    Look, he writes for a living, so he knows what he’s talking about.

  171. I don’t have time to debate things that should be obvious to any professional working writer.

    Seb — actually, no, it wasn’t a ‘boast’, and you calling it one doesn’t alter the fact. The only ‘trolling’ I see here is you. I find your replies offensive in the extreme and you seem to want to provoke an argument or ‘elicit a rise’ from me. I’ve already stated that I thought the line worked in the show. However, the rule of three is a much derided writers cliche. This isn’t exactly news: it’s been a cliche for at least twenty years — probably longer. How can you be a working writer and NOT know this? Like I already stated — comedy as a genre is one of the few instances where the device actually works when properly employed (for example: this episode of Red Dwarf).

    The writing course example was just that – an example. Stop it with the strawman arguments (that really is ‘trolling’). I’m a successful writer ‘who learned to do things one way’. News to me. There you go with the strawman again.

    As for your statement about the ‘irrelevance’ of my writing ‘credentials’ — sure, yeah. I get that. And the next time I have a heart attack I’ll seek the advice of an amateur veterinarian instead of a qualified cardiologist. She probably just wasted those 7 years in med school and those five years specialising anyway. What? She’s been a cardiologist for seventeen years? Who the hell cares? I watched an episode of ER last night!

    That makes about as much sense as what you just alluded to.

    Bottom line: I don’t have the time or the inclination to debate the basics of writing to someone who obviously ‘doesn’t get it’. So I’m done. I don’t owe you an education or an explanation above what I’ve already given you. If you’re going to argue a point — at least make sure you know what the hell you’re talking about instead of arguing from ignorance.

    I won’t respond to any more of your posts here.

  172. Let’s Talk About Twentica (on UKTV Play)

    I say, what a cracking idea.

  173. G&T Admin

    Boy, this $23m musical is going to be great.

    Regardless of your incredibly impressive credentials that you’ve made up, I don’t think you understand what the rule of three even is. The only way I can make sense of this conversation is to assume that you and literally everyone else are talking at cross purposes, because you appear to be talking nonsense.

  174. Regardless of your incredibly impressive credentials that you’ve made up.

    Jim Steinman’s Bat Out of Hell The Musical — opening February in Manchester, moving over to London, then Toronto, Then Broadway. PM me and I’ll send you my name. When the musical comes out you’ll see it on the credits.

    Now, seriously, I’m done posting here.

  175. G&T Admin

    I assume you’ll be completely rewriting Two Out Of Three Ain’t Bad.

  176. G&T Admin

    What’s it called when arguing against a strawman argument is itself a strawman? Did they teach you that in your writing course, BDTS? Perhaps you could write me a song to explain exactly how good at doing writing you are?

  177. I liked it when they said Smeg.

  178. G&T Admin

    Jim Steinman’s Bat Out of Hell The Musical — opening February in Manchester, moving over to London, then Toronto, Then Broadway. PM me and I’ll send you my name. When the musical comes out you’ll see it on the credits.

    Sounds like a very big production, you must’ve been making cups of tea near constantly.

  179. I assume you’ll be completely rewriting Two Out Of Three Ain’t Bad.

    Even the admin’s troll. Nice. Two Out Of Three is a tongue in cheek play on that very phrase — in itself alluding to the cliche. Jim wrote it in 1976. Look at all of the song titles on the Bat albums — they’re all cliched turns of phrase.

    RE – the ‘admin’ responses above. Nice way to treat posters here. When one of you loses an argument (through your own stupidity), you all fall in and gang up on the poster together. It means nothing to me, but it’s a pretty sad fact that you feel like you have to do this.

    Well done — you managed to elicit one more response. Are you finished now? I know that I am. I’ll leave you to your rather sad corner of the Internet.

  180. >I assume you’ll be completely rewriting Two Out Of Three Ain’t Bad.

  181. G&T Admin

    Even the admin’s troll. Nice. Two Out Of Three is a tongue in cheek play on that very phrase — in itself alluding to the cliche. Jim wrote it in 1976. Look at all of the song titles on the Bat albums — they’re all cliched turns of phrase.

    Fuck me, whatever you did for this musical you certainly didn’t handle the jokes, did you?

  182. G&T Admin

    Even the admin’s troll. Nice.

    Did they teach you apostrophe use on your writing course, or just hyperbole?

  183. Even the admin’s troll. Nice. Two Out Of Three is a tongue in cheek play on that very phrase — in itself alluding to the cliche. Jim wrote it in 1976. Look at all of the song titles on the Bat albums — they’re all cliched turns of phrase.

    RE – the ‘admin’ responses above. Nice way to treat posters here. When one of you loses an argument (through your own stupidity), you all fall in and gang up on the poster together. It means nothing to me, but it’s a pretty sad fact that you feel like you have to do this.

    Well done — you managed to elicit one more response. Are you finished now? I know that I am. I’ll leave you to your rather sad corner of the Internet.

    I like that this paragraphs in this post stick to the classic Rule Of Three.

  184. G&T Admin

    Srsly though, I’m not sure what you mean by “trolling” here, but if you just mean taking the piss then yes. Yes, I am. But please note that I’m doing so as myself, not as a representative of this website. He says, as if this website is in any way important.

    What’s happened here is that you’ve got into an inconsequential disagreement, but it’s escalated because your responses have been faintly ridiculous. Some piss-taking has – naturally – therefore occurred. This isn’t the sort of community where admins step in to break up piss-taking. We let it sort itself out, and sometimes take part in the conversation ourselves – the reason we have “G&T Admin” under our avatars is for the handful of occasions where we do have to be authoritative, but 99% of the time we’re just talking as individual Red Dwarf fans.

    I think you’ve made a couple of misconceptions about G&T as a community – namely thinking that people would be impressed by your real life credentials, and thinking that you’d be protected from having the piss taken out of you. Neither of these are the case, so if you’re no longer interested in this place as a result, then cheerio. But I hope you’ll bear these things in mind and stick around instead.

  185. G&T Admin

    your rather sad corner of the Internet.

    Norman? Is… is that you?

  186. Look at all of the song titles on the Bat albums — they’re all cliched turns of phrase.

    1. The Future
    2. Electric Chair
    3. The Arms of Orion
    4. Partyman
    5. Vicki Waiting
    6. Trust
    7. Lemon Crush
    8. Scandalous!
    9. Batdance

  187. Ian — in the heat of the moment (and the fact that I’m trying to work at the same time) I’m aware that I’ve completely lost my sense of humour. You’ll have to forgive me for that. However, I never posted that info to ‘impress’ anyone. The only thing that I was trying to ‘impress’ was that I’m a working writer, and that I’m at level where I use these conventions every day (okay, that’s hyperbole — it’s every other day). That’s not a boast or an ego trip — it’s just ‘stating what I do’.

    We’ll agree to disagree RE ‘the rule of three’.

    Thanks for the offer about sticking around — I’ll give it some thought.

  188. Look at all of the song titles on the Bat albums — they’re all cliched turns of phrase.

    1. The Future
    2. Electric Chair
    3. The Arms of Orion
    4. Partyman
    5. Vicki Waiting
    6. Trust
    7. Lemon Crush
    8. Scandalous!
    9. Batdance

    I like what you did there.

  189. G&T Admin

    There’s nowt to forgive – this is all just very silly, and the result of several misunderstandings. On my part, I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt regarding your motives for mentioning your credentials, and I won’t bring that up again. Agreeing to disagree is definitely the sensible thing to do at this stage!

  190. agree to disagree RE ‘the rule of three’

    Now THAT should be the title of something

  191. It’s almost an unwritten rule never to mention professional credentials in internet arguments, no matter how well meaning they may be. I’ve seen people leapt on with far more vitriol than seen in this thread, just for casually mentioning they studied music in threads discussing an artist / album. Unfortunately, regardless of how it’s intended, it’s usually read as “I’m a professional so my opinion trumps yours”. And I say that as a professional message board poster.

  192. “When I’m lord of the Starfleet, you’ll pay for that remark.”

  193. And thus it was, on an otherwise ordinary September day, that the Internet finally ticked the last item off the list and officially ran out of things to argue about.

  194. I thought the advert break was well-placed for this one. Most of the ones for X felt a little awkward, especially ‘Lemons’.

    Yeah, that was lame, but all the good points have already been talked about!

  195. https://postimg.org/image/ui8k8l2y5

    I never really connected the dots with the Borg thing until my second watch and I feel like a fooking mook. It’s so obvious, they even have the same naming system.

    As a person who knows Seven of Nine’s full name without referencing the internet, and who has been watching Red Dwarf professionally for over a decade, I hang my head in shame.

  196. People arguing on the internet is boring and also makes me feel a bit sad inside.

  197. G&T Admin

    Shut up Jimboid, no one asked you.

  198. Who the FUCK are you?!

    *flips table over*

  199. You’ve unscoffed my sodding pie! You bloody bastards!

  200. G&T Admin

    That’s it, I’m banning everyone.

  201. Right everyone. All the people who are waiting until TV broadcast, will have missed all of this. Please remember who it was you were fighting/arguing with, about what, and why it was all so important back then, so we can do this thread all again, just as inanely from Thursday, with new people joining in.

  202. I have a YouTube video with OVER 10,000 VIEWS. AND SOME COMMENTS, EVEN.

    Rimmer’s hair looks fine – better than RDX in my humble opinion, definitely better than in BtE.

    Same here. I’m sorry, I just can’t see it as a bad wig the way everyone is saying. I have a hard believing that anyone could look at this:

    …and declare RDX’s awkward black hair better. When it comes to the “it’s a bad wig!” thing, are some people just saying that because it looks different from Chris Barrie’s hair as it appeared in classic Red Dwarf? Would they be thinking it looked like a bad wig if they were seeing Rimmer for the first time? Because I really don’t think they would.

    Speaking of better hair, I’d really like to know why Rimmer’s hair is black in RDX and BtE, because that makes no sense to me at all. Granted I don’t know how hair dye or any of this works, but clearly they can make it brown in XI so why not before?

  203. Rimmer’s hair looks fine – better than RDX in my humble opinion, definitely better than in BtE.
    Same here. I’m sorry, I just can’t see it as a bad wig the way everyone is saying. I have a hard believing that anyone could look at this:…and declare RDX’s awkward black hair better. When it comes to the “it’s a bad wig!” thing, are some people just saying that because it looks different from Chris Barrie’s hair as it appeared in classic Red Dwarf? Would they be thinking it looked like a bad wig if they were seeing Rimmer for the first time? Because I really don’t think they would.
    Speaking of better hair, I’d really like to know why Rimmer’s hair is black in RDX and BtE, because that makes no sense to me at all. Granted I don’t know how hair dye or any of this works, but clearly they can make it brown in XI so why not before?

    I love how Rimmer’s hair looks in XI, it makes him look more youthful than he did in both X and BtE and more like the Rimmer of old. Having it longer doesn’t bother me at all, my only gripe would be that it could be a little curlier! By the looks of it in BtE I would say it was Chris’ normal hair without a hairpiece, but with hair thickener used which made it look a lot darker. Come X Chris had lost more hair so they needed to use a rug, don’t know why it was darker though? Very glad they went for a browner look this time round :)

  204. If Chris Barrie had his cock out throughout the entirety of BtE it’d still have been less distracting than his ridiculous dyed eyebrows.

  205. From the rehearsal footage in We’re Smegged, I don’t think his natural hair looked bad at all. I do miss the curliness of it.

  206. They’ve worked with his natural hair as much as possible, dying it, then dying the sides and using just the toupee, before going full wig. For what it’s worth I wouldn’t be bothered if they just used Chris Barrie’s normal hair. Easy to explain in dialogue and no problem. They’re too far down the rabbithole now I suppose.

  207. Actually I thought his hair was the most naturalistic element of his performance…

  208. Rimmer is a human, a hologramatic human, yes, but a human nonetheless. Sometimes, humans choose to dye their hair. I am quite happy to just accept that as a premise, I don’t need an episode to explain it to me…

    The boys from the Dwarf decide to treat themselves to a pamper day, because they are enlightened 23rd century guys who are comfortable with their sexuality. Kryten sets up a pop-up beauty parlour, Krytie’s Kutz, with the skutters as his assistants. Hilarity ensues.

  209. The boys from the Dwarf decide to treat themselves to a pamper day, because they are enlightened 23rd century guys who are comfortable with their sexuality. Kryten sets up a pop-up beauty parlour, Krytie’s Kutz, with the skutters as his assistants. Hilarity ensues.

    The Cat refuses to take part out of snobbery. Winds up jealous of the results.

    This is straight from Doug’s XIII notebook.

  210. “Sometimes you live, then you dye, then you live again.”

  211. Wasn’t Twentica out by now, a week ago? Where’s Samsara, or did they just promise the whole series a week early to fuck with me when it was actually just Twentica as a one-time promotion?

  212. I reckon we’ll have to wait until after Twentica goes out on Dave tonight. Twentica hitting UKTVPlay so early last week was probably a one-off, yes.

    I get it, seems strange to have 2 episodes online when 1 hasn’t even gone out on TV yet. As nice a surprise as it was, I just wish they hadn’t put Twentica out last Thursday morning as I’m sure some of us (yourself and myself at least 2) were expecting Samsara at the same sort of time

  213. First reactions to reading this thread….

    >Ha HA haha
    Haha!
    >post-Rob Dwarf
    I may start describing myself as a Rob Dwarf fan. You know, to myself.
    >(rule of 3 debate)
    Ooh. A few people throwing their string out of the pram.

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