Only The Good Is Alright

[bloodteller]

>Like in Krytie TV, where Lister and Rimmer quite easily sneak into the main part of the ship to sabotage ‘ex-boyfriend Tim’/Ackerman’s quarters.

Kryten explains he’s “paid off the guards” presumably so Lister can do this. Though given that crushed beer cans are used as currency in Krytie TV, i’m not exactly sure what he’s paying them off with. Krytie TV is a bit weird like that

>Having said all that, my favourite thing in all of series VIII was the LOVELY COSINESS of Lister getting anything he wanted from his cell by hammering on a pipe. Even if it was in one of the shite episodes.

yes, this was quite a nice moment

[flanl3]

…but in the mirror universe, does Rimmer have an enormous cock, or a fanny?

An enormous fanny.

[Ben Saunders]

Have you ever seen Harry Potter, teller? Imagine you’re late for class and you need to wait for the fucking stairs.

[bloodteller]

they had multiple forms of magical teleportation in Harry Potter though, didn’t they? who would even need the stairs

[Ben Saunders]

Can’t do any of the magical teleportation methods within school grounds because of school rules/plot reasons

[International Debris]

Kryten explains he’s “paid off the guards” presumably so Lister can do this.

And then Rimmer manages to get out as well. It totally breaks the reality of VIII for me.

Though given that crushed beer cans are used as currency in Krytie TV, i’m not exactly sure what he’s paying them off with. Krytie TV is a bit weird like that

Probably the same stuff he used to buy his gold Series 4000 mechanoid plating in a prison on a ship that was around long before he was invented.

[Dollar Pound]

when rimmer looks under the sheets his nob is on upside down

[bloodteller]

just noticed they use the line in Only The Good… about how if their prism laser isn’t perfect, the mirror universe could be an “imperfect version of our own” so that presumably explains why everything isn’t opposite in the mirrorverse.

makes you wonder how horrific it would’ve been if the mirror universe genuinely worked properly. for one thing, everyone’s skin would be inside out and rimmer wouldn’t be able to breathe since the atmosphere would’ve been whatever the fuck the opposite of oxygen is

[Ben Saunders]

I think I said this earlier in the thread, but the logical conclusion to “everything is opposite” means the universe wouldn’t exist, because ours does

[Ben Saunders]

Rimmer’s skin would be inside out, but “inside out” would mean the opposite, so it’d be the right way in

He couldn’t breathe anti-oxygen, but in that universe humans breath anti-oxygen, so he’d be fine

[Dollar Pound]

to the extent that the concepts they are about don’t quite hold together, the show’s episodes exist

[Moonlight]

Krytie TV is a great episode of VIII if you pretend it only consists of “The post has arrived.”

[Hamish]

Personally, I thought it started well but fell apart. All that stuff from back when the script was still entitled “No Strings Attached” — that was great. Then it all went cringe worthy and sexist and I fell into a dull torpor.

But sir, that was the cartoon that had taken over the main programme!

[International Debris]

Ok, enough replies to this thread. We don’t need the words ‘Only The Good Is Alright’ on the front page any more.

[GlenTokyo]

Then it all went cringe worthy and sexist and I fell into a dull torpor.

It’s an interesting topic is sexism in Red Dwarf. I was watching The Bodysnatcher collection commentaries from Ed and Doug and there’s a bit where Ed says that Ruby was in the edit for Kryten and remarked “and they say you can’t write for women” upon the reveal.

Seems to flop around from casual sexism, to simple feminism like the Parallel Universe male models stuff, then to creepy or actually offensive sexism (elbow titting anyone?). The shower stuff in Krytie TV is particularly awful if you ask me. There’s sort of a suggestion that they’re getting paid until Kochanski sees herself, and then you realise Kryten is at the centre of the Red Dwarf iCloud leak and should probably be charged for that too.

[Ben Saunders]

Should be pointed out that the voice of a character is not the voice of the author

Writing a character who elbow-tits is not condoning elbow-titting, especially when the joke is that it’s an awful thing to do (also Rimmer complaining about wheelchair ramps is not Doug Naylor complaining about wheelchair ramps)

Krytie TV though, even I’d have a hard time defending that

[GlenTokyo]

Yeah definitely. Just an interesting thing to look at over the years. Probably more for an essay or something though.

[bloodteller]

why does Krytie TV even exist? the subplot about The Appeal is pretty good, but pretty much everything involving Kryten in the episode is horrifically out-of-character and borderline offensive.

okay i get they reprogrammed Kryten to become sexist and such (how?) but why even go to those lengths? if you’re going to do a Red Dwarf episode about Kryten exploiting naked women then surely all it requires is the male prisoners ordering Kryten to film them- Kryten obviously wouldn’t want to, but since he can’t disobey human orders he’d have to do it anyway and he’d be all guilty about it.

[bloodteller]

an episode where Kryten is forced against his will into exploiting naked women isn’t really much better though i guess

[Ben Saunders]

But then Lister could just order him to stop.

I think the appeal stuff was from the pen of Doug Naylor while the rest was Paul Alexander, if I remember the VIII doc right

[International Debris]

Both are awful, but it’s particularly unpleasant watching Kryten enjoying it. It’s a low point of a very questionable series, regarding sex-and-gender issues (to be fair, it’s a questionable series on all issues). Most earlier examples of potentially dodgy stuff are generally characters being awful in character, or Rob and Doug being a bit clueless. But the pervy, rapey stuff in VIII is difficult to watch.

It also totally undermines Lister who, for all his laddishness, is always seen to have a certain amount of morals, and be generally a romantic sort of person. From wanting to ask out a hologramatic Kochanski to lending his coat to Irene, he’s always been able to see past sex when it comes down to it. Given that he and Kochanski are meant to be good friends by the time they get to Krytie TV (despite his tricking her into kissing him more than once), it seems totally wrong that he’ll happily watch video footage of her in the shower.

[International Debris]

And yeah, the whole appeal plot has potential. There’s definitely a character-based episode in that, one where they all end up in several tricky positions but have to hold their tongues, do things they don’t want to, in order to win the appeal.

I mean it’d still be all VIIIed up with terrible jokes about knobs and stuff, but it’d still be much better.

[bloodteller]

i think somebody mentioned it above, but originally there was a VIII script entirely about the appeal, called “No Strings Attached” which honestly sounds a lot better than what we ended up with.

also mentioned in the VIII scriptbook is a script called “Phwoaarrrr” about the crew all getting sexed to death, which sounds fucking awful

[Phil]

“also mentioned in the VIII scriptbook is a script called “Phwoaarrrr” about the crew all getting sexed to death, which sounds fucking awful”

Is it, though? I thought that was a working title for Krytie TV. It’s been a while since I lost my scriptbook, but I don’t remember it being a different entity with a distinct plot.

[bloodteller]

oh my bad, it’s not in the scriptbook, it’s in the DVD booklet for VIII. and yeah, Phwoaarrr was an entirely different episode about “a ship where a new perfume was being tested that was so effective that it caused insatiable attraction between those who smelled it- the result being some nocturnal activity between Rimmer and Kochanski, and much subsequent Lister jealousy. The tone and content of the story-including piles of nude, dead bodies- was considered inappropriate.”

why the fuck was Phwoaarrr considered inappropriate when they had the sexual magnetism virus in Back in the Red, and the penis in Pete, and the sex in Cassandra, and the sexual harassment in Krytie TV, and the incest in Only The Good?

[GlenTokyo]

When you see it like that it makes you think that 1998’s chapter in Doug’s memoir will be called “Randy”.

[Hamish]

> Ok, enough replies to this thread. We don’t need the words ‘Only The Good Is Alright’ on the front page any more.

*bump*

[Lily]

>sexual magnetism virus in Back in the Red,
yup, rapey

>and the penis in Pete,
just a sound effect and bits of string

>and the sex in Cassandra,
or the total lack of, which was rather the point

>and the sexual harassment in Krytie TV,
yup, awful

>and the incest in Only The Good
Sister Talia, spiritual advisor … that was the joke

[International Debris]

also mentioned in the VIII scriptbook is a script called “Phwoaarrrr” about the crew all getting sexed to death, which sounds fucking awful

I wonder if Chris Chibnall got his idea for the second episode of Torchwood from this.

Can’t wait for the new Doctor Who. :/

[bloodteller]

the point is, it seems kind of odd that Phwoaarrr was considered inappropriate, considering the content of the rest of VIII. it doesn’t really seem any more rapey than the sexual magnetism virus

[GlenTokyo]

It’d be harder to do Phwoaarrr visually. That’s probably the only reason it didn’t get done. Would be straight up VIII’s flagpole otherwise.

[bloodteller]

well they could’ve just gone down the Samsara route of having it be skeletons who’d fucked themselves to death

[Phil]

Well I’ll be. For some reason I’d retained the knowledge that it was just a working title with no distinguishing substance attached to it. Now I’ll spent the rest of my life trying to scrape that distinguishing substance out of my brain.

[Dollar Pound]

viii = lad

[Dollar Pound]

also what rubber said about casualty style titles… do the last day and beyond a joke count? or is it strictly half a saying? if so i’m having ‘a bird in the hand: part etc’ for pete. i’m surprised the writers’ room haven’t caught onto this one already

[Dollar Pound]

when life deals you lemons

[International Debris]

The Last Day always bugged me, as the rest of III is one word titles, a la The Young Ones, Blackadder II, etc.
When I was writing a sitcom – back in the day when I was an interesting, creative person – I planned every episode to have a one word title. It felt like a very sitcommy thing to do.

[flanl3]

The Last Day always bugged me, as the rest of III is one word titles, a la The Young Ones, Blackadder II, etc.
When I was writing a sitcom – back in the day when I was an interesting, creative person – I planned every episode to have a one word title. It felt like a very sitcommy thing to do.

Friends is a very bad sitcom.

[flanl3]

That post would have been perfectly true had I left out the blockquote.

[Ben Saunders]

Friends is actually pretty good, for America

[Dave]

The America that also gave us Frasier, Seinfeld, Arrested Development, Curb Your Enthusiasm, Louie, It’s Always Sunny In Philadelphia, Veep, The Simpsons, Malcolm In The Middle, and many others?

No, it’s not.

[International Debris]

Friends has lots of good jokes, but very few good episodes.

[Ben Saunders]

Yeah, that America. Frasier, The Simpsons and Malcolm are good. And Scrubs. I caught some of the first series of Friends recently and I remember one joke in particular that was just incredibly well set up, but I can’t remember what it was.

[si]

Community. American, great.

[flanl3]

BoJack Horseman isn’t a sitcom per se, but it’s American and better than Friends.

[GlenTokyo]

Friends is amazing compared to some of the dross that comes over from America. You might be able to write a list of things better than Friends, but you can write a bigger one of things a lot worse, The Big Bang Theory, 2 Broke Girls, The Great Indoors, most Netflix attempts at sitcoms etc

[Dave]

“Pretty good, for America” sounded like a suggestion that America wasn’t able to make decent sitcoms.

Even if there are lots of US sitcoms worse than Friends (and I’ll take your word for it), it still doesn’t mean that Friends sits among the best sitcoms that the US has to offer.

[International Debris]

Yes, it’s hard not to read the original statement as one of those “America is shit at comedy” remarks, which is just daft. Especially given how good it’s been in the last 15 years compared to the UK.

[Ben Saunders]

Many of the supposedly good American sitcoms mentioned here just don’t hit the spot for me. A couple of them do though. And in the past 15 years we’ve had Peep Show, The IT Crowd and the small rouge one representing us so we’re not doing too badly. Just ignore all the shite like Mrs Brown’s Boys and you’re good.

[Dollar Pound]

i always wanted a friends style ep of the show. it’s in an apartment in a block on the roof. between scenes there are soft rock interludes as it zooms out from the block.

[Author]

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