Mundane observation dome

[Warbodog]

Do you have any miscellaneous insights on the series that may be worth contemplating for a few seconds before moving on with our lives? Here are some of mine.

1. The four regulars have names that can work any way around, though this would have been more obvious if David Ross had stayed and wouldn’t work if Chris Barrie used his real name.

2. The series’ lax attitude to continuity extends to the setting. Outside of Holly’s distress calls, I don’t think three million years is mentioned all that much after series I and before VI (not sure about later years). Instead, we get the extremely fudged “dead for centuries” and “travelling for thousands of years” – not actual retcons, but suggesting a more conventional setting for casual viewers tuning in and the sort of stories they’re telling. It’s only millions when they need it to be.

3. 200 years of stasis between series V and VI means that the earlier series took place in their equivalent of the early 19th century by comparison (e.g. Blackadder the Third). Since they didn’t run into a long-lived Camille or one of her great-great-etc grandchildren, it didn’t come up.

4. Although Lister is routinely slagged off in the series, he’s spared the level of seemingly authoritative character assassination that Rimmer gets, because the audience is aligned with Lister’s viewpoint most of the time. For example, we see Kochanski Camille belittling Rimmer’s interests, but we don’t get the equivalent of Hologram Camille reacting to Lister’s pickup lines, we’re left to form our own opinions on those. This flimsy point has not been considered much beyond this single example.

5. Cat’s costumes are overwhelmingly referenced more than anyone else’s in the series, but the least discussed by fans.

6. Ace Rimmer and Duane Dibbley were so seemingly ubiquitous in canon and tie-in merchandise through the 90s (Smegazine strips, T-shirts) that they still feel overused today, even though it’s been over 20 years since they appeared. Maybe they’re allowed back after all.

7. Only series III & V and maybe XI & XII (not as familiar with those) don’t have any sense of an arc whatsoever (though IV’s minor Kryten disobedience arc was already fucked up by episode shuffling). Series III is just about the only series where no episode directly references any previous episode, but it still has the Backwards scrolling text and general references to Rimmer having died and stuff.

8. One of the series’ most famous and quoted scenes – everybody’s dead, Dave – is a straight-up 2001: A Space Odyssey homage and would have been received that way at the time, but doesn’t work like that for most people coming to the episode later on or new viewers who are young or don’t watch old films.

9. Sometimes dismissed as lightweight and gimmicky today, Backwards was designed as an innovative interactive experience to reward extracurricular effort. As well as inviting fans to work out the backwards events and filming logistics, Arthur Smith’s eugolonom is teasingly long and “you scoundrels” is clearly a cleaned-up translation gag even before you’ve heard it. Unfortunately, by the time technology caught up with the intent and the ability to reverse media files properly on home computers became commonplace, Backwards Forwards came out and everyone just cheated with the walkthrough.

Imagine the quality of the musings I left out!

Topic

[Nick R]

[Unrumble]

[Moonlight]

Starting to suspect I have been a meme more times than anyone else on G&T. Adding that to my resume.

[RunawayTrain]

Blame my Red Dwarf server where we secretly plot to confuse and annoy you by using first names on G&T.

If anyone refers to a “KT” (which I know quinn has done several times) that is also me.

I knew it was you, but thought it was from Katydid :)

[Quinn: Clochebusters World Champion]

Blame my Red Dwarf server where we secretly plot to confuse and annoy you by using first names on G&T.
If anyone refers to a “KT” (which I know quinn has done several times) that is also me.

I knew it was you, but thought it was from Katydid :)

[Podey]

Gallifrey Gals have started series 7 and they liked Tikka To Ride a LOT. Even talk of it being in their top 3 episodes so far. I think they’re going to like a lot of this series and, as a series 7 apologist, this makes me very happy!

[Ian Symes]

I suspect it’s a lot better if you don’t have to wait three and a bit years for it. And if you’re bashing through the episodes at such a pace that you don’t have time to ponder on the bits that make no fucking sense. Tikka To Ride is, IMO, the best of VII by some distance, but I’m slightly surprised that they didn’t pick up on how the Kennedy paradox has the opposite effect to the future selves paradox in the same episode, considering how hot they are on timey wimey stuff. But I agree, I think they are going to like VII overall, they’re more sci-fi fans than comedy fans, so the temporary change of focus will suit them.

I believe they’re currently spoiler free about Rimmer’s comings and goings. This is gonna slay em.

[Flap Jack]

Tikka To Ride is, IMO, the best of VII by some distance

In the Coral Canvass I gave Tikka to Ride the same score as Blue, and a lower score than Duct Soup and Epideme. Am I a madman or a genius?

[Future Producer of Series IX – aaaaany day now]

I’m sorry but anyone who says Epideme isn’t peak VII is going down significantly in my estimations.

[Warbodog]

Epideme’s the breakout Cassandra of VII for me.

[Flap Jack]

Cool, so if I am a madman at least I have company at the asylum.

[Quinn: Clochebusters World Champion]

I’m with Ian. You’re all totally nuts. 

[International Debris]

Still hate Tikka. Nonsensical plot and awful gags. Blue is my VII peak, Epideme and Stoke are decent, Beyond a Joke has bizarrely grown on me for all its flaws. The rest can get to fuck.

[Podey]

Not gonna lie, I bloody love Epideme, annoying game show voice and all.

[International Debris]

Yeah, I get why people don’t like the voice, but as an episode it feels like it could have come from IV-VI, which I really appreciate. It’s an interesting sci-fi idea that has some philosophical leanings but also provides a lot of big laughs. It’s also a rare example of Kochanski slotting into the ensemble quite naturally.

[Jenuall]

And they were doing so well up until now! 

Also, I cannot stand Epideme, and it’s about 90% because of Epideme. Change the way the virus is played and characterised and you’ve probably got yourself halfway back to a decent episode. 

[Future Producer of Series IX – aaaaany day now]

Somebody get Sir Patrick on the line, see if he’s still up for a laugh.

[Nick R]

“I wish that Epideme was voiced by someone else.”

*Monkey’s Paw curls*

“No, no! I take it back! I wish that somebody else voiced Epideme.”

*Monkey’s Paw curls*

[Podey]

There’s also the added element of old man Lister from ‘Future Echoes’ having a robot arm, which potentially plays into our Lister losing his. Hopefully the gals will pick up on that as they saw it so comparatively recently. 

[Moonlight]

It’s also a rare example of Kochanski slotting into the ensemble quite naturally.

It’s a big disappointment to me that just as her character is starting to feel like part of the gang, VII ends, the show violently shifts format, and she spends VIII having sex crimes done to her.

[Dave]

[International Debris]

It’s a big disappointment to me that just as her character is starting to feel like part of the gang, VII ends, the show violently shifts format, and she spends VIII having sex crimes done to her.

Yeah, it’s not peak Dwarf, but the overall feel and dynamic of Beyond a Joke and Epideme suggests a potential future for that version of the crew, with some tighter writing it could be a prototype for a decent VIII. And then Doug did… well, I think we might have discussed VIII before. 

[Formica]

It’s microscopically interesting to me that casual RD circles see VII as such a low point (even moreso than we do around here) and yet maybe the ninth or tenth most common lazy red dwarf facebook post is somebody showing their salad cream in or out of the fridge.

[Warbodog]

casual RD circles see VII as such a low point (even moreso than we do around here)

[Hamish]

VII does actually get better without Rimmer but not really because of it. It just takes a little while past that to find its feet before tripping and falling again.

[Unrumble]

well, I think we might have discussed VIII before. 

[Frank Smeghammer]

It’s microscopically interesting to me that casual RD circles see VII as such a low point (even moreso than we do around here) and yet maybe the ninth or tenth most common lazy red dwarf facebook post is somebody showing their salad cream in or out of the fridge.

See also the “you’re lying” scene with Kryten and Ace piloting a crocodile

[Podey]

[Ridley]

Meltdown, Holoship and Tikka to Ride is quite the top three*

*Despite the significant drag factor of Holoship

[Dave]

I’ve never felt older than seeing them not recognising Brian Cox, even after they knew who he was.

[Dave]

I’ve never watched one of these before but it is genuinely refreshing to see a different (and well justified) take on these episodes. I’m now intrigued to see what they will make of Ouroboros (and Kochanski joining the crew), and especially once they get into VIII.

I do feel that VII, while not at the same level as the earlier years, is somewhat tarred by association with VIII – if VIII had been better I think VII might have been seen as just a little wobble while Doug started off without Rob, rather than a severe downturn.

So it’ll be interesting to see if and how their feelings about VII change as they move forward, especially given that VII starts off strong and then falters.

[Podey]

I think they’re going to like Kochanski’s addition. I also think they’re going to hate the casual (and at times not so casual) sexism in 8. 

I’ve really enjoyed their reactions, it’s worth going back if you’re so inclined. I remember they were very impressed by how progressive Parallel Universe was in its commentary on gender dynamics, for the time period.

[Ian Symes]

Impressive that they’ve got Chris Veale to do their thumbnails.

[Ridley]

I’ve never watched one of these before but it is genuinely refreshing to see a different (and well justified) take on these episodes. I’m now intrigued to see what they will make of Ouroboros (and Kochanski joining the crew), and especially once they get into VIII.

Yeah, I’ve been cherry picking their older episodes here and there since their Tikka praise on G&T got me to actually to look their way which a same old 1-6 yay, post-6 boo reaction wouldn’t.

If they come away pro-VII, I look forward to their Back to Earth take.

The Series VII test

The Series VIII test

The Back to Earth test

The Taiwan Tony test

The Timewave test

[Warbodog]

1-6 yay, post-6 boo reaction

[Ben Saunders]

Meltdown, Holoship and Tikka to Ride is quite the top three*
*Despite the significant drag factor of Holoship

I can’t remember my rankings exactly but I’m pretty sure they’re all top 5 to me

[Moonlight]

Holoship is definitely in my top 5 if I recall from the last survey where we actually ranked them in order.

[Podey]

Not one of my favourites but then I love series 7 so what do I know.

[Podey]

I honestly would struggle to pick a top 3, in seriousness, I think it’s more that I have a top however-many that are always in positional rotation. 

[Warbodog]

I can do 14th, 39th, 58th, and Holoship’s only that high because of Binks.

Stoke is my 6th worst, which is some achievement considering there are more episodes than that in VIII alone.

[Formica]

Stoke is my 6th worst, which is some achievement considering there are more episodes than that in VIII alone.

The crocodile sequence alone is better than anything in VIII. I can’t fathom the extreme negative value you must place on the rest of the episode for it to drop that low.

[Warbodog]

It was kid-me’s Phantom Menace.

[Dave]

It was kid-me’s Phantom Menace.

Yeah but Series VIII makes Stoke look like fucking Shaft!

[Jenuall]

I wish I’d kept my submissions to the Canvass – can’t remember exactly where I placed these episodes now, but Holoship is a banger so I would have had that at least in the top 20. Meltdown almost certainly in the top 3, and Tikka is usually my highest rated of VII so that would likely have been somewhere not too far outside the bubble boundary.

I’ve really enjoyed watching along with the Gallifrey Gals reactions, it is always nice to see people discover something you love and see how they respond to various bits. Watching them really enjoy Tikka and Stoke has actually made me enjoy rewatching them more myself, much easier to go along with a positive vibe in the room!

It can however be a bit frustrating when they don’t react to some of the gold in there – pretty sure the lightbulb exchange got little to no reaction from them for example! Or even worse is when reaction creators cut key sections of an episode out of their upload so you never get to see what they thought of it! Yes I know, they have to cut things for copyright reasons, as well as to enable them to paywall content for their patreon – I’m fine with that, people make interesting stuff they should be able to monetise it if they want – but it’s still a shame!

[Future Producer of Series IX – aaaaany day now]

Yeah but Series VIII makes Stoke look like fucking Shaft!

I think you got that the other way around, Bisley.

[Dave]

 I think you got that the other way around, Bisley.

Pete Part Two’s a big pile of shit!

[Ridley]

You kneed Death in the bollocks, Rim.

[Warbodog]

Pete Part Two’s a big pile of shit!

[Unrumble]

[Dave]

[Author]

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