Your Unpopular Red Dwarf Opinions

[Piplup2003]

The title says it all. What opinions do you have about Red Dwarf that no-one else seems to agree on?

For me, it’s that VIII is my second favourite series (behind V) and that I prefer Chloë over Claire as Kochanski (this may be partially influenced by the fact that I’ve met Chloë).

And please, no arguing.

Topic

[Nick R]

(Posting to get past the page break bug)

[Moonlight]

[theycallhernebraska]

In the event that more Dwarf is produced, I wouldn’t be mad if Kryten’s CPU was moved into a model 3000 series that happens to look exactly like a 75-year old Robert Llewelyn. He’s old. We all understand that he’s old. He could still play the character without having rubber glued to his face. 

Never understood why in a scifi show of all things they didnt just write around this the second it became a problem and make him human again/the new computer/whatever. God knows any of the Dave series coulda made space for a Kryten gets a Heart episode.

[Flap Jack]

I don’t think it’s that inexplicable. It’s because they wanted Kryten to look good. If your character is a robot, it’s better – and much funnier – if they look like a robot. Yes, in many sci-fi stories there are ultra realistic androids that just look like people, but this is a comedy. You want your robot character to stick out and look weird.

Also, it’s not as simple as Robert’s experience with the prosthetics getting worse and worse over the years. The experience was really at its worst at the very beginning, and over time it was improved. So because Robert has always been game to put up with it (while still complaining of course), they didn’t have much reason to consider getting rid of it. It was only in the most recent episodes that it risked becoming too much for him.

I do feel guilty about the fact that every time someone suggests getting Robert out of the prosthetics as Kryten permanently, my immediate reaction is “yes, they could, but that would be shit.” Ultimately I trust that if it is too much of an issue in a hypothetical future Dwarf project, Bobby and the production team will sort something out.

[Unrumble]

Get Doug to channel any ‘de-aging Lister’ funds into a CGI head for Bobby. That way he only has to walk around with some dots stuck to his face.

[Moonlight]

That’s what Danny was pitching in response to my DwarfCast question a little while back. But what I actually wanted to hear was whether they’d put up with him looking like a sad old man.

[Technopeasant]

I believe Jim Carrey said he’d be willing to reprise the Grinch… if they did mo-cap.

But honestly yeah, whatever makes Robert comfortable.

[Technopeasant]

There were at least some great late-era games like Worms: The Director’s Cut and Slam Tilt.

No idea why he’s kicking for a pinball game.

[Dave]

[Nick R]

[Quinn: Clochebusters World Champion]

[Flap Jack]

[Dave]

[Nick R]

[Moonlight]

[Dave]

[Warbodog]

A bit late with this.

[Nick R]

[Nick R]

It’s a shame that we’re doing all these Worms jokes while Niki Hutchinson isn’t here.

[Jimboid]

Back to Earth is massively underrated. 
On a recent marathon rewatch, it was such a palate cleanse after VIII.
Like coming home after an abnoxiously raucous party full of people you hate.

You open the door to peace and quiet.

The lack of studio audience just adds to the serenity. 

[International Debris]

I find BtE needs the context of following VIII to really work. I still think it’s a mostly mediocre script, but the fact that it’s so character focused and actually Red Dwarf-ish makes it seem like a masterpiece in comparison to what came before.

[Podey]

I know it’s not what people want RD to be but I think BtE succeeds in having emotional heft. I can’t help but get choked up at Lister’s big scenes.

[Rushy]

I know it’s not what people want RD to be but I think BtE succeeds in having emotional heft. I can’t help but get choked up at Lister’s big scenes.

Back to Earth – for all its flaws – is Craig’s finest hour as the character. 

[Warbodog]

Demons & Angels is the one I think of for Craig being particularly good. Being pursued, tortured, remote controlled and making Low Lister a convincing separate entity, dodgy compositing aside.

[Unrumble]

Demons & Angels is the one I think of for Craig being particularly good. Being pursued, tortured, remote controlled and making Low Lister a convincing separate entity, dodgy compositing aside.

Absolutely. I know the costume and beard do some of the work, but he’s so unlike regular Lister.

Cat and Rimmer work well in their introductory scenes, but during the group scene where they implant the remote control, they lose a little bit of their mystique, and come across more like the actors trying to do ‘evil-er’ versions of the character’s voices.

[tombow]

I always find it mildly sad in that ep that “good” just means losing your identity and becoming an identikit monk

although I suppose we already saw actual “good” versions of everyone in Dimension Jump

[Rushy]

I feel like it’s a parody of the Buddhist idea of transcendence, everyone becoming part of a “unified field”. A lot of what makes us who we are is based on earthly concerns: obsessions with material things, worrying about being embarrassed, the various little neuroses we have. 

A transcended being – in theory – cuts through all that and is concerned with nothing but virtue for its own sake. I think Major Briggs from the show Twin Peaks is a better written example of this, and how it can also make one oblivious to more ‘basic concerns’. Briggs had the keenest insight of anyone in the show, but completely failed to grasp why his teenage son was acting out. 

[Flap Jack]

I feel like it’s a parody of the Buddhist idea of transcendence, everyone becoming part of a “unified field”. A lot of what makes us who we are is based on earthly concerns: obsessions with material things, worrying about being embarrassed, the various little neuroses we have.

Oh, it undeniably is. The issue isn’t that it doesn’t make sense as a joke, it’s that it’s just one generic joke rather than 5 separate ones that are more character specific, like with the Low crew.

[Dave]

To me it kind of makes sense that there’s a single unified model of goodness and morality to aspire to, but you can be debased and corrupt in thousands of different, more idiosyncratic ways.

Although having said that, for the logic of D&A to work, the good qualities have to be present somewhere in the original personality, just like the bad ones are. So maybe it would make more sense to have different High versions of the crew each doing stuff that was altruistic and selfless in a different way.

[International Debris]

It’s mostly that Rob and Doug could think of far more fun and interesting ways of doing the low versions of the characters. It’s hard to make high versions that are both character related and funny. 

[Moonlight]

It’s mostly that Rob and Doug could think of far more fun and interesting ways of doing the low versions of the characters. It’s hard to make high versions that are both character related and funny. 

Plus, we already have Ace.

[Dave]

He should have just had the High versions be the regular crew but with the addition of Lewis Pemberton.

[Podey]

If you think of it within the “highs and lows” framework it makes more sense than “good and bad”, because the “highs” are – I presume – enlightened.

[Flap Jack]

I guess there was also the element of the High crew needing to be kind of annoying, so we didn’t feel too bad when they all got murdered – and we didn’t generally feel conflicted about our crew not trying to save them to begin with.

So it would have been harder to achieve that while giving them more unique personalities, but I still would have liked to have seen it attempted.

[Rushy]

I like how watching horror film franchises can only mean you’re evil

[International Debris]

The contents of the low bunkroom always remind me of Cyberia from Last Human. 

But yeah, there’s a slight conflation of ‘low culture’ and ‘low morals’ in the concept which does seem to align watching splatter movies and eating awful junk food with being a psychopathic killer, which doesn’t quite work.

[Dave]

But yeah, there’s a slight conflation of ‘low culture’ and ‘low morals’ in the concept which does seem to align watching splatter movies and eating awful junk food with being a psychopathic killer, which doesn’t quite work.

I’m not sure if we’re meant to draw a causal link, especially as the low crew don’t actually have any real history and were only created less than an hour ago, so wouldn’t have had time to watch any of those videos anyway.

It’s just that everything on the Low version of Red Dwarf is meant to be the trashiest, worst version possible. The videos probably don’t even play properly. The toilets are broken. The doors stick. The food is mouldy. 

It’s like low-Cat and low-Kryten say later on in the episode:

[Rushy]

I really wanted more of Low Holly for, errr, reasons

[International Debris]

I’m not sure if we’re meant to draw a causal link, especially as the low crew don’t actually have any real history and were only created less than an hour ago, so wouldn’t have had time to watch any of those videos anyway.
It’s just that everything on the Low version of Red Dwarf is meant to be the trashiest, worst version possible. The videos probably don’t even play properly. The toilets are broken. The doors stick. The food is mouldy.  

Oh yeah, definitely, it’s just… I dunno, it’s so broad that it probably ends up being a touch too unfocused, maybe. Like, we’re given an explanation for Lister being so horrible, his dabbling in shitty behaviour being the entire basis for a whole person, but that’s a different concept to there happening to be terrible b-movies and horrible food sat around. It’s not like cinema hot dogs are ‘part of’ Lister’s curries, for example. 

It just feels like it’s trying to do too many things at once, which stops it from conveying as much of a message as we get in similar stories like Polymorph, Terrorform, Dimension Jump and so on, which is why I think it usually ends up being the least liked episode of V. 

[Dave]

I really wanted more of Low Holly for, errr, reasons

[Ben Saunders]

Actually, you have.

[Technopeasant]

I’m not sure if we’re meant to draw a causal link

[Warbodog]

The music selection also wasn’t violent death metal or something, it was just lame music.

[Technopeasant]

[Rushy]

I think this snobbery towards horror films and “meaningless sex” is really just a by-product of the times in which the episode was made in. 

Rob and Doug themselves obviously aren’t prudes, but they knew that such things were considered a bit tacky at the time, and used it as part of the comedy because it would make people laugh. 

[Danny Stephenson]

The music selection also wasn’t violent death metal or something, it was just lame music.

What I found odd about that particular joke, is it sounds like Rimmer’s normal music collection.

[Moonlight]

Possibly a joke in the idea that Rimmer’s music collection is exactly the same on the Low ship.

[International Debris]

Yeah, it’s the music that reminds me most of Cyberia. Along with the stringy brown lettuce, it’s like a living punishment. 

[Moonlight]

…does that CD say “Frank Assisi and the Apostles”?

Is this another Red Dwarf Frank? 

[Ian Symes]

It’s not an additional Frank, as it’s also referenced in dialogue later in the episode, so it’s already included in the Official Frank Counter in that video I made.

[Author]

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