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  • #233492

    Still think Hogey’s map should return. Touches like that, hints at a larger arc – like the quantum rod – are lovely, but seem to just die off. C’mon Doug.

    #233494
    Lily
    Participant

    Unpopular opinion – not ever sci-fi show needs to have an arc and I think Doctor Who has suffered for it in the past.

    The only arc I want to see on Red Dwarf has Cats on it.

    #233495
    Warbodog
    Member

    Series 1 & 6 had good arcs that enhance those series. I’m wary of arcs because of how VIII turned out and X’s chaotic production that kept the set-up but ditched the pay-off, but I’d still love to see something more ambitious mixed in, rather than just playing it safe with Polymorphs and Backwardses until the end.

    #233496
    GlenTokyo
    Participant

    It’s a shame that arcs/ multiparters are seemingly not an option though on Red Dwarf because Doug blames the format and not the fact that Back in the Red and Pete were not naturally long enough to be three episodes and shit respectively, even a series before, Epideme and Nanarchy weren’t bad, not classics but fine.

    I don’t really want multiparters/arcs that much but a little persistence would be nice, so something could happen and it maybe gets mentioned in passing at some point. I feel like the Dave series lack identity and having some kind of arc, or theme would help.

    #233498
    Jonsmad
    Participant

    Entangled is mostly genius writing of highest standard ever achieved by the whole of Red Dwarf,
    its exposition including the beggs choke scene makes total sense, is consistent with Koestler it’s source material and the episode is unique among the rules of television plotting as a result of it’s non causal approach. Everything is good until the monkey/naked stuff.

    #233499
    Dax101
    Participant

    The beggs choking is either totally silly or actually kinda clever… But If you go by the episodes logic that Kryten and cat were just aware it was gonna happen then that’s where it gets silly

    3 characters all choking at the same time seems lazy

    #233510

    I honestly think Entangled is fantastic until the chimp shows up.

    And yes, arc-wise I was definitely talking more about subtle hints and occasionally recurring ideas rather than a big, detailed single plot. The map just seems a very strange thing to have introduced and then just completely forgotten about.

    #233511
    Dax101
    Participant

    Id have been happy if the whole episode of engaged was just the crew on the hunt to find something or someway that they could remove the groinal exploder.

    I agree that the moment we get to the chimp it feels like Doug is biting off more then he can chew with throwing in so many different ideas and trying to bring them all together by the end.

    Oh and that ending with her tripping over some boxes sideways into the airlock which conveniently shuts behind her and is unable to be opened from inside is so bad IMO. even if the final line is kinda amusing it is still what Doug had to do to get to that point that is kinda stupid.

    #233512
    Dax101
    Participant

    I mean *entangled, not engaged…

    #233514

    >and is unable to be opened from inside is so bad IMO.

    Actually Professor E accidentally kills herself in that event, paraphrasing Rimmer, “Don’t press that!”

    #233520
    GlenTokyo
    Participant

    Professor E was so shit anyway, and as an ending killing her was just ridiculously cold. She did everything wrong, why not make it obvious she’d be great with Rimmer and then have her make the wrong decision and leave? And if you really want her gone have her borrow a shuttle and say don’t go near that wormhole and then she goes down it. At least she’s alive. Also the upside down glasses were a particular low moment in Red Dwarf history.

    #233523

    lel, I didn’t think it was that bad.

    #233535

    The upside-down glasses are terrible, Irene E / irony is weak and largely nonsense (I suppose it kind of ties in with the quantum entanglement / coincidence thing, but even then it’s pretty shit), and the idea of a person who does everything ‘wrong’ is really one dimensional and cartoony. It really goes to shit once they arrive at ERRA, which is a shame as there’s LOADS in the first 2/3 of the episode that I absolutely love. Losing Rimmer in a poker game feels like a really classic Dwarf idea, ‘apart from me and him and him’ is a great Cat line, ‘English boarding school’, the BEGGs’ descriptions of the crew, ‘Did it work?’ ‘No’. All that stuff was the point where it really felt like Red Dwarf was fucking great again, after three episodes that were almost there for me. And then the ending threw it all away.

    #233536

    Cat’s “except for me him and him” is a shit line.

    #233537
    Ben Saunders
    Participant

    I know the OP said no arguing but I’ll meet you outside after school and fight you for that one

    Entangled was incredible until it was shit, it was a real shame. I loved Kryten’s speech about the institute, it felt really magical and like Red Dwarf really was back. Briefly.

    #233538
    Ben Saunders
    Participant

    Upside down glasses though, fucking hell

    #233540
    bloodteller
    Participant

    i wonder if Entangled would’ve been thoroughly brilliant had they kept the original second half of the script (iirc it involved the chimp simply staying a chimp, but they couldn’t work around chimp actors only being able to do 45mins work at a time) or if the script would’ve fallen apart around that point anyway. kryten and cat’s entanglement never seems to get resolved in the episode either, so what was the point of all of it?

    #233543
    Pete Part Three
    Participant

    I wonder how many other episodes of Red Dwarf would be improved by a man in an unrealistic chimp costume turning up for the last ten miniutes.

    #233544
    Hamish
    Participant

    Officer Rimmer.

    #233545

    Waiting for God …. Lister follows Cat into the bowls of the ship only to find Cat has a pet chimp chained up and he is feeding him bananas.

    Lister stands up for the chimp, releases him, and he goes onto causes carnage, destroying everything it comes across before reaching the garbage pod and tearing through the waste, much to Rimmer’s horror.

    #233548
    bloodteller
    Participant

    Pete Part 2 has two chimps for the price of one

    #233554
    bloodteller
    Participant

    >I wonder how many other episodes of Red Dwarf would be improved by a man in an unrealistic chimp costume turning up for the last ten miniutes.

    timewave. a chimp comes onboard and leaves a banana peel on the floor for Ziggy to slip over and break his neck. he is then later killed by malpractice owing to the hairdressers doing the spinal reconstruction surgery injecting him with 500cc’s of TRESemmé

    #233557
    Dax101
    Participant

    >i wonder if Entangled would’ve been thoroughly brilliant had they kept the original second half of the script (iirc it involved the chimp simply staying a chimp, but they couldn’t work around chimp actors only being able to do 45mins work at a time)

    I can’t remember where Doug said it but i swear he talked about the idea of the chimp playing a big part in either that episode or another episode where Rimmer and Lister were gonna be acting like parents to this chimp as Rimmer wanted to use the chimp to help him pass the officers exam and Lister was gonna be against Rimmer using the chimp like that.

    I don’t know how i feel about that idea though.

    #233561

    >I can’t remember where Doug said it but i swear he talked about the idea of the chimp playing a big part in either that episode or another episode where Rimmer and Lister were gonna be acting like parents to this chimp as Rimmer wanted to use the chimp to help him pass the officers exam and Lister was gonna be against Rimmer using the chimp like that.

    I heard about this too, from where tho, can’t remember

    #233590

    I honestly can’t really see any ending working well. ERRA should have been the climax of the episode, and the quantum entanglement plot should have been used to wrap things up there – somehow involving Kryten and Cat relaying the code to remove the groin exploder by talking at the same time on different ends of the ship to each other, for example. It could have ended on Kryten going ‘owwwww yeah-yeah!’ or something.

    #233599
    GlenTokyo
    Participant

    I think the og chimp plans are relayed via Richard Naylor on the documentary.

    #233630
    Taiwan Tony
    Participant

    Would now be a good time to do my monkey impression….?

    #234165
    Katydid
    Participant

    Series XI is one of the best series of Red Dwarf.

    #234167
    Ben Saunders
    Participant

    It’s definitely in the top 6

    #234170

    >It’s definitely in the top 6

    Which Rob Grant-involved series did it overthrow?

    #234174
    Ben Saunders
    Participant

    The first one

    #234180
    Hamish
    Participant

    No

    #234182
    Ben Saunders
    Participant

    Grr

    #234184
    bloodteller
    Participant

    The first series of Red Dwarf is one of the best series of Red Dwarf

    #234190
    Ben Saunders
    Participant

    Most of the series of Red Dwarf are one of the best series of Red Dwarf, honestly. There are only 12 and most of them are quite good.

    #234193
    Dave
    Participant

    Apart from *that* one. Oh, and *that* one too.

    #234219
    Hamish
    Participant

    Yes.

    #234228
    Flap Jack
    Participant

    Red Dwarf Series 1 is easily in my Top 8 Red Dwarf Series.

    #234243
    Taiwan Tony
    Participant

    Series 1 and 2 are the best series of Red Dwarf

    #234244
    Ben Paddon
    Participant

    Back to Earth, while not perfect, is genuinely brilliant.

    The worst part is, a lot of people agreed with me as it was going out. We loved it. And then at some point after the shine wore off, people started to talk as if it had been an unmitigated disaster on all fronts. The idea that BTE is a bad show became accepted wisdom, and I don’t get it. I don’t get that transition at all, from adored to deplored in under five years.

    It puts me in mind of Avatar, a film that is universally reviled (and one I’ve somehow never seen) but managed to make nearly $2.79 billion at the box office. It’s still, still!, the highest-grossing movie in history – if nobody liked it, how come every bugger went out and saw it eleven times each?

    For my money, BTE is still some incredibly strong Red Dwarf, and a good template for how a complete reboot/reworking of the series as a single-camera dram-com could work. Certainly it’s a lot better at the comedy/drama balance than VII (which I also like, though nowhere near as much). For its flaws, BTE is the Dwarf I have revisited the most in the near-decade since its broadcast, and whenever people bash it – on here, on Twitter, at Q&As, wherever – it always feels like they’re squinting at a Magic Eye picture that I can see and they can’t.

    I can see the sailboat… I wish everyone else could, too.

    #234245
    bloodteller
    Participant

    Back To Earth was quite good outside of the Coronation Street stuff and that crap scene where they drive Carbug to some ill-fitting music, I thought.

    Back To Earth is quite a strong character piece, especially for Lister- and it balances the comedy and drama fairly well- e.g. the scene with the kids on the bus is funny (“even in that Bible film, she said “Jesus? He’s not dead!”) but it’s also quite a good bit of character analysis on Lister and what sort of a guy he is.

    also, the chinatown chase scene is epic. it’s intense stuff, that

    #234246
    Dax101
    Participant

    Funny enough i remember BTE got a very Meh! reaction after the 3rd episode, and i remember being quite saddened about it at the time as i thought it might effect Dave putting money into making a new series since a fair amount of the criticism was that it felt like a tired self-referential comeback.

    In reflection though, i don’t like story because it feels like a fourth wall breaking parody with jokes about the Fans, the show in itself and the cast with one of the worse moments in Dwarf history in part 2 where the crew discovers they are characters in a tv show. its so surreal and ridiculous but is played as straight as the cast could make it work.

    Reminds me of the Dispensing machine bonking scene in Dear Dave since maybe it sounded good in Dougs head but it really does not work on screen at all.

    #234248
    Dax101
    Participant

    >Back To Earth is quite a strong character piece, especially for Lister

    Problem is the character stuff with Lister feels like an afterthought. and its possible it very well could have been since wasn’t it Andrew Ellard that came up with the idea of having Kochanski appear at the end?

    Even the Joy Squid feels abit like an afterthought too since by the end the concept of the “joy” squid doesn’t add anything to whats happening until they realize that it is infact the joy squid and then Kochanski suddenly appears to keep lister there.

    Yeah lister throws a line in about feeling great since they got there, but they were trying to find their creator so they wouldn’t die? pooping their selves in the elevator ride up there and then thought they killed the guy… such joy!

    #234249
    Flap Jack
    Participant

    Just to join in with the “at the time it went out” perspective, I distinctly remember how I felt when Back to Earth first broadcast. I was delighted to see ANY new Red Dwarf, but I was also really underwhelmed.

    Outside of episode 2 the laughs were very thin on the ground, and the lack of a live audience – despite there still being gaps left for their reactions – made it feel especially awkward. The performances in a lot of scenes – such as the sneeze ironing scene or Rimmer dancing while the others were attacked by the squid – just felt kind of forced, illiciting a “this seems like it should be funny – why isn’t it funny?” reaction from me.

    I still firmly enjoyed it overall – the comedy in episode 2 and the atmosphere of episode 3 helped with that – but I still couldn’t avoid being disappointed that it didn’t feel like proper Red Dwarf.

    #234250
    Dave
    Participant

    It’s quite common for initial enthusiasm for a series to give way to a more measured opinion over time. The same happened with VIII to some extent.

    For what it’s worth, I now enjoy BTE slightly more than I did when it went out. Initially I was quite disappointed but now I at least appreciate what it was trying to do and the limitations it was operating under, and it has some good gags in isolation.

    #234255
    Warbodog
    Member

    The weird fan episode polls after VII and VIII are probably the best evidence of the recency bias.

    You can see it with a lot of things. If you look up reddit discussions of Doctor Who’s arc-tastic episodes from 2011 that most people have decided they hated now, they were well into it at the time.

    I always thought BTE was fine for a special, but not something I’d feel like rewatching. It didn’t disappoint me like VII & VIII, but it didn’t fill me with over-optimistic confidence like Trojan either.

    #234256
    Plastic Percy
    Participant

    I still bloody love Back to Earth, me.

    #234262

    I always agree with the suggestion they should another special in the vain of BtE, improve on it with newfound experience.

    Plus, I always liked that deleted bunk scene, wish they kept it. But yeah BtE was fine, I remember being disappointed with it when I discovered the whole show and binged on it back in 2012; but now I think it’s fine.

    #234267
    tombow
    Participant

    I liked BTE mostly, I liked it’s ambition and the jokes were fun, I liked the silly stuff like the Starbug car and the big ideas it had. I really think it needed some kind of audience laughter on its TV broadcast though. To be honest, I feel the same way about any sitcom-style banter being put in a movie context, like the Rising Damp film from the 70s – that kind of banter just doesn’t work without an audience to bounce off.

    And silly stuff like the car and going to Corrie is the kind of stuff that needs camaraderie and other fans with you to enjoy because it’s only really funny because it’s silly fun, it’s not like the most witty conversations from series 1-5 that I would enjoy in any format.

    Speaking of the Rising Damp film – it would have been similar to the RD film in that it was a reboot that started again and re-made the origin story.

    #234268
    Ben Paddon
    Participant

    I really think it needed some kind of audience laughter on its TV broadcast though.

    Every time someone’s tried to do this, it’s been terrible. It wasn’t written with an audience in mind, and showing to an audience after the fact a la VII wouldn’t have worked. BtE is better without one.

    That being said… so is VII, sometimes. The Xtended versions are a brilliant exercise in showing us why stuff that winds up on the cutting room floor should probably stay there, but awkward pauses aside VII fares a lot better without the audience laughter.

    #234270
    Dax101
    Participant

    >It wasn’t written with an audience in mind

    Well according to Doug the thought of having an audience was there, its just they couldn’t afford one.

    One idea was to have the audience for everything before they go “back to earth” and then the laughter track would be gone for their earth adventure. which would certainly add an even more meta feel to it.

    #234271
    Jawscvmcdia
    Participant

    I prefer the captain as “Dennis the Donut Boy”.

    #234272
    Pete Part Three
    Participant

    I’ve started to enjoy Jawscvmcdia’s forum threads.

    #234280

    I thought BtE was worse than VIII when it went out. After watching the whole run through with my girlfriend and getting a bit of an ‘experiencing the show for the first time’ thing vicariously through her, I remembered what made the show great and BtE suddenly felt light years ahead of VIII. I still don’t think it’s especially good, but it is at least Red Dwarf, and listening to Doug’s commentary was a wonderful optimistic moment that made me think he’d rediscovered the show he was writing 20 years before again.

    #234281
    Dax101
    Participant

    You do get alot of insight into Dougs mindset in the commentary. for good and for bad IMO.

    #234294
    Flap Jack
    Participant

    To me, the lack of an audience was really felt in episode 1, but it wasn’t too noticeable in episodes 2 and 3. So doing it either way wouldn’t quite work.

    Actually, imagine if episode 1 had a studio audience, but then the audience was absent from the moment they go into the “real” world? That could have been an amazing way to add to the misdirection of the plot.

    Or it could have been terrible. I don’t know, I’m just some asshole on the internet.

    #234296

    It’s been suggested before, and yes, I think it would be brilliant. Suddenly not having the audience would really give such a strange change of tone that it would really drive home how odd the moment is.

    #234298
    Dax101
    Participant

    It would drive home that the crew just stepped out of the tv show boundries and into the real world.

    Basically the same as what it was, just more meta, and just as silly.

    #234300
    bloodteller
    Participant

    yeah, that would’ve been quite good.

    #234303
    clem
    Participant

    It’s mainly the Blade Runner stuff that drags down BTE for me. I agree having an audience until they get to Earth could have been really good. Doesn’t it go a bit handheld and less sitcom looking when they enter the “real world”?
    That might only be because a lot of the Earth stuff was filmed on location, though.

    #234304
    clem
    Participant

    Which of course was done out of necessity, so it’s not necessarily something they were going for.

    #234307
    Dax101
    Participant

    Personally i am glad they just didn’t have an audience at all. i really wouldn’t want the audience acknowledged like that no matter how more meta it is to convince the audience they were in our world and not the tv show world.

    #234308
    GlenTokyo
    Participant

    I really hate the Blade Runner stuff it just doesn’t go for me at all. I know Doug loves Blade Runner, I love Blade Runner, but that doesn’t mean I try and crowbar it in to my work. A little reference is ok, a pinch of salt to some caramel, it can enhance the flavour, but Doug poured a tin of Carnation caramel onto a grit silo.

    #234330
    Hamish
    Participant

    And I am not even particularly fond of Blade Runner.

    #234331
    flanl3
    Participant

    I am not a massive fan of blades or running, myself.

    #234384
    Ben Paddon
    Participant

    One idea was to have the audience for everything before they go “back to earth” and then the laughter track would be gone for their earth adventure. which would certainly add an even more meta feel to it.

    I always thought that was a fan-idea rather than one that’d come up during production, but it was something I always liked the idea of.

    #234387
    Plastic Percy
    Participant

    I just never took Blade Runner to be a massive influence on the film. I thought Grant Naylor was fairly adamant it was Dark Star.

    #234423
    Ben Paddon
    Participant

    The Blade Runner stuff didn’t bother me any more than the Terminator stuff in “The Last Day” or the Casablanca stuff in “Camille”. I think it worked just fine.

    #234430
    tombow
    Participant

    The voice swapping in Bodyswap is fine and works well for the idea.

    #234439
    Warbodog
    Member

    I don’t mind them doing Blade Runner, I just hate the line about Blade Runner being THE inspiration for Red Dwarf when it’s far from evident outside of this one and Back to Reality (unless it’s supposed to be some further squiddy link between those two episodes).

    It makes even less sense in-universe – if they’ve seen Blade Runner, hearing that their lives were based on it would just seem nonsensical. I’d be fine with Alien, maybe 2001, haven’t seen Dark Star.

    #234440
    bloodteller
    Participant

    >The Blade Runner stuff didn’t bother me any more than the Terminator stuff in “The Last Day” or the Casablanca stuff in “Camille”

    there’s also the Alien stuff in Polymorph, and the Westworld stuff in Meltdown. Red Dwarf doing direct parodies of things isn’t anything new, so it didn’t feel at all out of place in Back To Earth for me.

    #234441
    Hamish
    Participant

    Meltdown borrows the premise, but is not a direct parody.

    “Clues” is not a parody of “Thanks for the Memory”.

    #234445
    Pete Part Three
    Participant

    The way Red Dwarf typically handles references compared to the way it handles them in Back to Earth, is like comparing Spaced to Ready Player One.

    #234447
    Dave
    Participant

    Also Robocop in DNA.

    #234448
    Ben Paddon
    Participant

    The way Red Dwarf typically handles references compared to the way it handles them in Back to Earth, is like comparing Spaced to Ready Player One.

    I think that is more often than not the case, yes, but the show has plenty of overt examples of parody. “DNA” is one of them, specifically the Jaws reference, and the Casablanca stuff in “Camille” isn’t exactly subtle.

    Granted, BTE is the only example I can think of where the show actively states the name the thing it’s parodying, and we can argue about whether or not that was appropriate until the cow’s come home (or not, let’s actually not do that, please for the love of God) but it’s not something that bothers me, it doesn’t stick out much more than other overt parody in the show, and I’m fine with it.

    #234451
    Dave
    Participant

    “DNA” is one of them, specifically the Jaws reference

    Dimension Jump, surely.

    DNA has mini-Robocop and a Die Hard gag though.

    #234452
    Dave
    Participant

    Oh, you mean the bit with the lager can – I thought you meant the parts where the show explicitly references an existing property by name, like Jaws in Dimension Jump and Casablanca in Camille.

    #234454
    Ben Paddon
    Participant

    I can’t believe I said BTE was the only example etc. etc. wow, I’m an idiot.

    #234455
    Ben Saunders
    Participant

    >Granted, BTE is the only example I can think of where the show actively states the name the thing it’s parodying
    Camille does as well

    #234456

    Rimmer’s death is a reference to Citizen Kane in Me² and gazpacho soup is a reference to rosebud

    Later in the episode, Lister tells Rimmer he and Cat are watching Citizen Kane at the cinema

    #234457

    The subtle-as-a-brick referencing of Blade Runner in BtE is obviously different to previous homages because of its meta nature, but it does seem a bit heavy going, outright copying sections without even a joke attached.

    The idea that Blade Runner was the main inspiration behind Red Dwarf is absurd. They don’t really share much. You can see Dark Star and Alien in Red Dwarf, but not Blade Runner.

    #234458

    Mimas in IWCD always gave me Blade Runner vibes

    #234460
    tombow
    Participant

    Little off topic but, I read William Gibson’s Neuromancer recently and I was surprised at how RD-feeling it was, everything from the writing style being similar to the novels, VR worlds where people are tempted to stay with lost loves, A.I.s with cheeky personalities running ships, even afro-Caribbean guys with dreads being main characters.

    #234461
    bloodteller
    Participant

    >Mimas in IWCD always gave me Blade Runner vibes

    it reminded me more of New York, especially with the descriptions of the traffic

    #258076
    Veni
    Member

    Related to the special, I really don’t care if it focuses on Cat, despite seemingly everybody else’s thoughts.

    Yes, the felis sapiens are returning, and I think it’d be great for a Cat subplot to emerge with a possible love interest, but beyond that it should be a Lister story ala Waiting for God which focused on Lister (despite my prior claims it was a Cat-centric story when I ranked all the episodes, and even then I admitted I was bullshitting).

    Cat is largely one-dimensional and a comic relief, yes, he has details related to him like his clothing, or certain traits and dislikes he may possess, but 90 minutes dedicated to him? God no.

    People always moan about him being an asshole in XI and XII, he was literally, always an asshole. He’s a dick during Rimmer’s sendoff in Me2, he mocks Rimmer in Thanks for the Memory behind his back about how many times he’s had sex, he mocks Holly during his battle with Queeg (and don’t give me the entire crew weren’t behind him, this was after Holly had confronted them about not supporting him and Cat does it again anyway), he openly tells Lister he doesn’t give a shit about him in Backwards. Cat is a douchebag, that’s his character. If anything he’s way more sympathetic in Dave Dwarf cause he actually has flaws.

    I don’t know, I never liked the character much to begin with anyway, so feel how you want to.

    #258077
    Spaceworm Jim
    Participant

    Is the special actually focusing on Cat? The press release made it sound like it was more of a Lister story. Waiting for God isn’t an episode focused on Cat even though the story of his species is the only thing resembling a moving plot in it, as Rimmer’s garbage pod story is entirely static. Even Can of Worms isn’t really revealing anything new about the Cat, or interesting about any of the characters.

    Cat doesn’t mock Holly during the battle with Queeg, he offers him (admittedly not very helpful) advice. Other than that, I broadly agree with you, Veni, except I think the difference between Cat’s arseholeness in the earlier series and these latest ones is that he was funnier in the old days. “Let’s get out of here before they bring him back!” is far funnier than that one from Entangled, “except for me, him and him”, which I think is an abysmal line and makes me cringe just as much as the Blue Midget dance from Back in the Red. Is that an unpopular opinion? I don’t know, I’m pretty mainstream and bland when it comes to opinions. I think Kryten is funnier than Rimmer in Series 6?

    The guy who hosts the Empire podcast said Red Dwarf 1 and 2 were crap and it only took off when Kryten joined, which left me almost annoyed! This is a bit apropos of nothing, but I have nowhere else to vent about that.

    Whatever, though, you can feel how you want to. That’s probably how feelings work.

    #258079
    Dax101
    Participant

    Going by the Gazpacho Soup article. yeah its bit more focused on Lister. but Rimmer and cat do get some story focus too.

    #258081
    Veni
    Member

    I was more so referring to Cat’s, “Bye, bye, baldy,” remark in Queeg.

    I definitely agree, though, Kryten in series VI is what made me really love the character, so he blows everyone else out of the water in that series if you ask me.

    #258085

    Cat is largely one-dimensional and a comic relief, yes, he has details related to him like his clothing, or certain traits and dislikes he may possess, but 90 minutes dedicated to him? God no.

    In large part because he hasn’t ever really been given anything to actually flesh him out much as a character. Yes, he has been used as one-dimensional comic relief, but there really isn’t any reason that a Cat focused story shouldn’t work if that’s what Doug decided to do. There’s actually a lot about the Cat we don’t know, there’s a whole history to him prior to meeting Lister and Rimmer that we know nothing about. That could be good to explore in the right setting, and meeting his own people after all this time could just well do that.

    #258086
    Dave
    Participant

    I’m hoping for extensive “young Cat” flashbacks featuring a digitally-youthed Danny John-Jules, Marvel style, but on a Red Dwarf budget.

    #258090
    Taiwan Tony
    Participant

    Red Dwarf: Genisys.

    #258092
    si
    Participant

    Red Dwarf: Genisys.

    Red Dwarf: Mega Dryve.

    #258093
    Dax101
    Participant

    >I’m hoping for extensive “young Cat” flashbacks featuring a digitally-youthed Danny John-Jules, Marvel style, but on a Red Dwarf budget.

    If Doug could afford de-aging effects, he probably would write a whole episode around it. dunno how much of the budget would be left over for everything else though.

    #258095
    Dave
    Participant

    Digital youthing on a Red Dwarf budget would be DJJ running around wearing a cardboard cutout of his face circa The End.

    #258096

    Just use his nephew who played young Lister. Granted he’d be mid 20s by now, but I’m sure it’d work.

    #258097
    Veni
    Member

    Yes, he has been used as one-dimensional comic relief, but there really isn’t any reason that a Cat focused story shouldn’t work if that’s what Doug decided to do. There’s actually a lot about the Cat we don’t know, there’s a whole history to him prior to meeting Lister and Rimmer that we know nothing about. That could be good to explore in the right setting, and meeting his own people after all this time could just well do that.

    The main point is I don’t care much for the character to begin with, so unless the movie is able to make him sympathize with him in the movie itself, I’m not going to be bothered.

    #258098
    Ridley
    Participant

    Digital youthing on a Red Dwarf budget would be DJJ running around wearing a cardboard cutout of his face circa The End.

    They should do that though.

    #258107
    desbug
    Participant

    He youthed me!

    #258328
    Offline
    Member

    Series VI is my favourite of them all but I do agree that Emohawk and Rimmerworld are woefully average retreads at best and Psirens needed one or two more drafts to take it into great territory. Legion, Gunmen and Out of Time are absolute crackers though and the reason it elevates to the top for me.

    #258378
    Shoes Have Soles
    Participant

    RD works better without Holly since Kryten was introduced and they should stop trying to bring the character back. Sorry Norm/Hattie.

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